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planetc

(8,324 posts)
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:31 PM Jul 2024

I don't know what all the fuss is about: Biden won the debate.

He won for four reasons:

1. By default. His opponent appeared in a televised campaign rally while pretending to debate. (Has this lie been added to the list?)

2. On substance. His replies to the questions contained only facts, policies, accurate history, and laws enacted. His opponent threw verbal food at Biden for 90 minutes.

3. Mr. Biden used only polite formal English, and did not indulge in vulgarisms. He let his expressions of annoyance, disbelief, and disgust do the work of foul language.

4. At no point did Mr. Biden leap across the stage and attempt to throttle his opponent manually. Really, his self-discipline is admirable.

Honestly, I'm beginning to think that no one in the country, including the NYT, watched the debate. The whole media-invented "crisis" does not exist.

14 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Fiendish Thingy

(18,816 posts)
1. 50 million watched the debate
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:34 PM
Jul 2024

And a large number see Biden’s performance differently than you do.

planetc

(8,324 posts)
10. How large a number, and what differences do they see?
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 04:00 PM
Jul 2024

My second two reasons are not serious, but the first two are.

madaboutharry

(41,390 posts)
2. I think a major problem for Biden was the laryngitis.
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:40 PM
Jul 2024

His voice was gone and it was hard to hear him. It exasperated the perception of a weak old man and people have used it to jump on the “Biden is too old bandwagon.”
The attacks on him continue to be so unfair, even cruel.

Meadowoak

(6,294 posts)
4. 91% of democrats still support Biden, but when
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:46 PM
Jul 2024

Asked if he's too old, 83% say he's too old. They are both too old, but 91% will still vote for Biden.

TwilightZone

(28,834 posts)
3. It's not that simple.
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:43 PM
Jul 2024

Politics can be an emotional game and appearances are often much more important to the masses than content.

If presidential races were solely about substance and ideas, Trump would have been laughed off the stage in 2015. Alas, they are not, and we are all poorer for it.

valleyrogue

(1,200 posts)
5. Of course he did.
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:47 PM
Jul 2024

It was evident in the transcript.

Seth Abramson had a long article about the debate I think yesterday on his Substack, and made it a point to note how hard Biden works for the American people. He worked too hard when he went to Europe right before the debate, and he paid the price with his cold and his laryngitis. Abramson has lots of links of videos showing Trump's clear mental decline. While Alzheimer's disease isn't linked to heredity from what I have been able to find out, it is important to note his father, Fred, Sr., had it though he died of pneumonia.

duncang

(3,729 posts)
6. Tfg lied over 30 times
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:52 PM
Jul 2024

I don’t know the total time each had for answers. So can’t break down minutes per lies. But that doesn’t seem to matter at least in the medias eyes. So the media doesn’t care how many lies. Just does it make a catchy lead. Everyone already knows he lies constantly so old news.

If they wanted some kind of honest review they would bring that up at least as much if not more since at least to most honest people that should matter.

valleyrogue

(1,200 posts)
7. Seth Abramson counted 602 lies in 40 minutes
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:55 PM
Jul 2024

Abramson documented every single lie Trump told in that debate and documented those lies in his Substack newsletter.

LetMyPeopleVote

(155,538 posts)
8. Biden lacked oomph, but the transcript tells a different tale
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:58 PM
Jul 2024

The content of President Biden's responses was accurate and actually made great points.



https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/4745771-biden-lacked-oomph-but-the-transcript-tells-a-different-tale/

President Biden obviously did not have a good night in his debate with Donald Trump. The White House claimed he had a cold. His soft voice and bumbling manner played right into the MAGA narrative that he is past his use-by date. The chattering class said it was a disaster for Biden. He even alarmed many Democrats.

But, reading the cold transcript, we get a very different picture of Biden. Substantively, he ably and forcefully made the case that that Trump should not be allowed back in the Oval Office.

While the timbre of Biden’s voice was soft, and he occasionally lost his train of thought, he struck some hard and telling blows. Let’s review the transcript.

On his age: “I spent half my career being criticized being the youngest person in politics. I was the second-youngest person ever elected to the United States Senate. And now I’m the oldest. This guy’s three years younger and a lot less competent. I think that just look at the record. Look what I’ve done. Look how I’ve turned around the horrible situation he left me.”

On Trump’s character: Trump is legally and morally compromised. He is a convicted felon, and had sex with an adult movie actress while his wife was pregnant. He accosted E. Jean Carroll in a department store dressing room. It is no answer that Hunter Biden is also a convicted felon. Hunter Biden is not running for president.

On Trump’s place in history: Historians rate Trump the worst president in our 230-year history.

On NATO: Trump wants to get out of NATO. “You’re going to stay in NATO or you’re going to pull out of NATO?” “Our strength lies in our alliances.”......

It was Trump who demonstrably lied in the debate, lied with the utmost self-assurance, evaded questioning with irresponsive answers bristling with alternative facts and lame denials. Biden was on message. I only wish he had had more oomph.

My bottom line: Disaster may not be irretrievable. To put it starkly, here’s the deal: Vote for a convicted felon trying to lie his way back into power or vote for someone who has proven he can get the job done. I make no excuses for Biden, but as Adelaide lamented in “Guys and Dolls,” “A person can develop a bad, bad cold.”

LeftInTX

(30,623 posts)
9. No one scores it as an actual debate. It's a TV appearance
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 03:58 PM
Jul 2024

No one reads the transcripts. It doesn't matter that he used formal English.

planetc

(8,324 posts)
14. Just to return to a point I made earlier, that Biden's debate is being viewed as a "performance" ...
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 06:43 PM
Jul 2024

by the media. They hyped it for weeks as a debate, and then scored it as a performance. A few people did read the transcript, at least here on DU. And my second two points were meant to be funny--I thought we could all use a small laugh. (Curses! Foiled again!) Biden, then, had to play by the rules, of debate, of serious government, of formal public communication. the trump creature was, as he always has been, unconstrained by any rules. He could say whatever he wanted. In fact, the "reviews" of Biden's "performance" were lousy reviews, since there was no mention of his opponent's performance, and no specifics of what Biden messed up. Those who looked at the whole debate, or read the transcripts, didn't think the President had anything to apologize for at all. But the media are playing to their base, who don't do transcripts, are a little fuzzy on what debates are, and have attention spans of six seconds, tops.

sop

(11,587 posts)
12. All these discussions about Biden's debate performance inevitably always circle back to the perception thing.
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 04:14 PM
Jul 2024

Republican strategist Lee Atwater once said, “Perception is reality.” Corporate media understands this concept all too well; their reporting mostly consists of creating perceptions to influence viewers. They want voters' perceptions of Biden's performance to matter more than what he (and Trump) actually said during the debate.

Talitha

(7,482 posts)
13. I didn't watch it because Dump is so nauseating.
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 05:36 PM
Jul 2024

But I read the transcript and Joe definitely won.

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