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WarGamer

(14,233 posts)
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:12 PM Sep 6

Neoconservatives headed into the Democratic Party tent...

This could be explained thoroughly in a loooong thread but I don't have time for that.

Let's just start with this.

According to Justin Vaisse, Senior Fellow at Brookings and expert on neoconservatism...

Neoconservatism is based on 5 pillars.

1) Internationalism

2) Primacy

3) Militarism

4) Democracy

5) Unilateralism

Trump threatens each and every one of the 5 pillars of neoconservatism.

Depending on world events... neocons find allies in the Democratic Party on at least 3/5 of the pillars.

The other day I called it the "neocon-ification" of the Democratic Party. And I don't like it.

I understand Trump brings strange allies to the Party... but for the love of Dog, DO NOT sell our souls.


The NeverTrumpers may have failed to prevent Donald Trump from becoming president, but he has been a godsend for their public reputations. Instead of remaining in the wilderness, the neoconservatives who make up the bulk of the NeverTrump movement have fitfully begun to move back toward, or at least flirt with, the Democratic Party, which is where the original neocon journey began.

https://washingtonmonthly.com/2018/10/28/neocons-paved-the-way-for-trump-at-least-max-boot-admits-it/





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Think. Again.

(15,386 posts)
1. The old school rightwingers....
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:16 PM
Sep 6

...won't be turning Blue, they won't be answering poll questions, and they probably won't be voting FOR a Black woman, but after trump just publicly trashed dick cheney tonight, they won't be voting FOR him either.

Ocelot II

(119,188 posts)
2. We can't afford purity testing right now.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:19 PM
Sep 6

The enemies of our enemy are not necessarily our friends but they can be useful temporary allies. We win the election and worry about those guys later but I doubt they'll want to stay under the Dem umbrella anyhow.

wnylib

(23,613 posts)
9. I hope that you are right that they won't stay in the Dem party.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:55 PM
Sep 6

If they do stay, they will try to take over the party and push out the liberals. Then there will be two parties on the Left, the liberals and the far left socialists. Splitting up the Left could hurt us.

Coexist

(25,294 posts)
3. My thoughts, not that they are worth a lot, is that we all understand this temporary alliance
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:23 PM
Sep 6

is to crush the anti-Democratic elements in the Republican Party so badly, that they will take a very long time to regroup.

After that, the Never-Trump republicans will reset their party with traditional conservatives, and we will go on arguing about tax rates, and foreign policy, like we always do, having different angles on these things.

To me this is a 'put the fight on hold while we fumigate' action that is understood.

I could be wrong

WarGamer

(14,233 posts)
8. I don't believe the neocons will ever go back.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:51 PM
Sep 6

Post Trump... the GOP will come up with another Trump... younger, more articulate, double the IQ, maybe non-white and maybe female...

Look at the Romney run. Trump beat those vote totals by TENS of millions.

In 28, you're going to see someone like Gabbard, Vivek or MAYBE a Trojan horse like Matthew McConaughey

House of Roberts

(5,517 posts)
5. Hardly any of these William F. Buckley Conservatives have a place anymore
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:38 PM
Sep 6

in the Republican Party.
In their version of the party, truth telling was important, and their belief in the strength of their argument, persuasive enough to win on policy, was the goal. Try working that into the modern day Republican Party, funded by the spoiled brat richfuck donor class, and you'd be shown the door if not thrown through it by their thugs.

WarGamer

(14,233 posts)
6. Neocons, at their core... believe in American Hegemony.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:40 PM
Sep 6

Max Boot, former conservative and present day anti-Trumper said:

After 9/11, he endorsed American imperialism in a Weekly Standardcover story. The benighted countries of the Middle East, he announced, “cry out for the sort of enlightened foreign administration once provided by self-confident Englishmen in jodhpurs and pith helmets.” His name became a synonym for neocon warmonger, and he went on to advise the George W. Bush administration and presidential aspirants such as Senator Marco Rubio.

House of Roberts

(5,517 posts)
7. We're stuck between a rock and a hard place in regard to hegemony.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 09:47 PM
Sep 6

We either exert our control over a given area of the world, or Russia, or China, or even Iran, moves into the vacuum we leave if we don't.

haele

(13,181 posts)
15. The enemy of my enemy is okay so long as I can keep an eye on them.
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 10:53 PM
Sep 6

They are not necessarily my friend, but they can be a temporary ally.

They are still scorpions.

Haele

KentuckyWoman

(6,837 posts)
13. Not exactly in the tent...
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 10:31 PM
Sep 6

They are saying they'll vote against Trump. To do so they are stuck with Harris. Once MAGA is tossed to the curb the battles will commence same as always.

bigtree

(88,781 posts)
14. this would make sense if all we did was parry this rhetoric around
Fri Sep 6, 2024, 10:37 PM
Sep 6

...like we do on the internet.

The reality is that most of our nation's progress has been bipartisan, and most Americans have said in every election since I've been politically active that they want the parties to work together.

We bring our interests and concerns into the political arena from myriad diverse and disparate regions of the nation and work to reconcile all of that ambition and need into action or law.

None of it is guaranteed, and the opportunity for unilateral advancement of legislation is so rare as to necessitate some sort of unity; especially on issues of importance like national security, or national health.

Besides, those 'pillars' you describe are ideology, not action, and, all we're asking republicans to do is vote; not become party chairmen.

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