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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNY Times finally details Trump's cognitive decline in scathing article
Former President Donald J. Trump vividly recounted how the audience at his climactic debate with Vice President Kamala Harris was on his side. Except that there was no audience. The debate was held in an empty hall. No one went crazy, as Mr. Trump put it, because no one was there.
Anyone can misremember, of course. But the debate had been just a week earlier and a fairly memorable moment. And it was hardly the only time Mr. Trump has seemed confused, forgetful, incoherent or disconnected from reality lately. In fact, it happens so often these days that it no longer even generates much attention.
He rambles, he repeats himself, he roams from thought to thought some of them hard to understand, some of them unfinished, some of them factually fantastical. He voices outlandish claims that seem to be made up out of whole cloth. He digresses into bizarre tangents about golf, about sharks, about his own beautiful body. He relishes a great day in Louisiana after spending the day in Georgia. He expresses fear that North Korea is trying to kill me when he presumably means Iran. As late as last month, Mr. Trump was still speaking as if he were running against President Biden, five weeks after his withdrawal from the race.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/06/us/politics/trump-speeches-age-cognitive-decline.html?unlocked_article_code=1.QE4.Sj6N.wDMvFD_Cmj4k&smid=url-share
Vogon_Glory
(9,592 posts)posted and only now does the New York Times condescend to formally take note of no. 45s mental deterioration.
Pototan
(2,099 posts)...and there are plenty of votes still to be cast.
Vogon_Glory
(9,592 posts)the way the Times is acting these days, Id almost expect them to wait to say something the first Wednesday of November.
NonPC
(405 posts)You can count on her to come thru for Trump.
nankerphelge
(1,024 posts)n/t
BaronChocula
(2,522 posts)The press/media is doing a GOOD job at covering trump according to her.
Wonder Why
(4,698 posts)ours are being mailed out starting October 14th. I cannot wait!!!!! One week from tomorrow. Whoooo Hoooooo!
Gaytano70
(1,207 posts)I'm not holding my breath 🙄
Lovie777
(15,198 posts)but the media trashed Pres Biden and hounded him to step aside 24/7 claiming him with mental decline.
Oh, what a tangled we web weave, when first we practice to deceive.
Joinfortmill
(16,603 posts)Montauk6
(8,766 posts)That escalator ride down wasn't just a literal decline.
MiHale
(10,872 posts)Im talking about turning into a puddle of human brain waste
no recovery.
What happens? Does Vance automatically become the presidential candidate? Votes cast?
Bernardo de La Paz
(51,200 posts)On inaugural morning, Vance would be sworn in as VP semi-publicly, name a cabinet who would be sworn in temporarily, and then they would invoke 25th Amendment. Vance would then be sworn in as President and give his address.
I have no research or indications, but it seems logical to me based on how things have been done in the past with no specific precedents.
IF ... but I also think Harris will be #47, not a Republican.
MiHale
(10,872 posts)markodochartaigh
(2,221 posts)like a show pony, making promotional appearances around the country while Vance and the maga power structure strip the US of everything of value and sell it for pennies on the dollar, or give it to various oiligarchs. And cause social chaos to keep the population divided and distracted so that we can be controlled.
As long as Trump only has to do 15 minutes at a time in highly controlled environments surrounded by true believers I think that he has a couple more years in him. After that, if they still need him to generate loyalty from the crowd, they could probably say that due to the assassination attempts and the general chaos he has to be kept behind closed doors. They could probably use AI for the occasional speech.
Inside of a decade they could probably stage an anointing by "Jesus" that would be accepted by a third of the population and keep Trump on indefinitely, the first hundred year old president.
LiberalArkie
(16,641 posts)Buns_of_Fire
(17,934 posts)Ivanka can do the before with Goya. TSF can do the after with Beano. Covers both ends.
BattleRow
(1,255 posts)all the methane from those Beanos?
Mz Pip
(27,927 posts)the GOP needs him. At this point, they have nothing without Trump at the helm. So theyll prop him up as long as they can, then, if he becomes uncontrollable, theyll do the 25th Amendment. I do expect that to happen within a couple of years. Trump wont be quietly demented like Reagan.
kimbutgar
(23,568 posts)Saying something so outlandish that his supporters stay home and not vote.
MyOwnPeace
(17,280 posts)but SO many of us have been saying that/wishing that for the past 9 years - I for one am not counting on ANYTHING except the VOTE to rid him from our lives!
Here's hoping/wishing that he goes DOWN IN FLAMES!!!!!!
kimbutgar
(23,568 posts)He can sent out mailers and have his rallies but wheres his get out the vote organization?
And VP Harris knows how to punch back hard. The convicted felon thought hed have slow a Joe and now hes got a quick on the punch back ex prosecutor and he has trouble punching back without saying childish things.
She is getting under his skin big time!
Retrograde
(10,716 posts)Horace Greeley, candidate for the Liberal Repbulican party (those are words you don't often see together anymore) died after election day but before the electors met. His few electoral votes were split among other candidates. It was largely moot since Grant won in a landslide.
It may depend on just when a candidate dies, but I'm not a constitutional scholar. If a candidate dies before election day, or before electoral votes are cast, can the party just designate a new candidate? Does it have to be someone already on the ticket, or are they free to choose any one they want - in which case we may see Junior and Eric slugging it out to see who steps into their father's shoes (remember Lara is the RNC chair - I don't expect her to leave that position without a fight). Does the VP candidate automatically step in and name a new VP? Will both houses have to approve this? Does it depend on who tips the Supreme Court the most?
I hope it'll be a moot point and the Dems will win handily in November
ms liberty
(9,874 posts)nuxvomica
(12,984 posts)Like they did when they piled-on on Biden.
OrlandoDem2
(2,318 posts)Martin Eden
(13,554 posts)Considering how much shit he constantly makes up, can he really be expected to remember actual facts?
His viability as a candidate for president NEVER should have gotten this far. Jan 6 should have been immediately disqualifying.
Mainstream media like the NYT shoulders much of the blame.
Chili Pepper
(124 posts)According to the NYT, hes just being factually fantastical.
Why cant the media just call his statements what they are - LIES - plain and simple
Martin Eden
(13,554 posts)And in the process they fail to accurately report the truth about Trump, normalizing what is dangerously abnormal.
mountain grammy
(27,365 posts)now a raging lunatic..I can't even imagine him as president. We cannot allow it!
Botany
(72,639 posts)And he heads off into rhetorical cul-de-sacs. So we built a thing called the Panama Canal, he told the conservative host Tucker Carlson last year. We lost 35,000 people to the mosquito, you know, malaria. We lost 35,000 people building we lost 35,000 people because of the mosquito. Vicious. They had to build under nets. It was one of the true great wonders of the world. As he said, One of the nine wonders of the world. No, no, it was one of the seven. It just happened a little while ago. You know, he says, Nine wonders of the world. You could make nine wonders. He wouldve been better off if he stuck with the nine and just said, Yeah, I think its nine.
Although people did sleep under mosquito netting.
ALBliberal
(2,881 posts)MyOwnPeace
(17,280 posts)"You know, the kind they have at those 3-story golf driving ranges. We got those because of our great leaders who first discovered them for that thing they call the Panarama Canal."
I'd love it if we could keep him around just to provide us with comic relief with his distorted 'American History.' However, we CANNOT allow him any closer to the White House than the Panama Canal is! Maybe he can start his 'stand-up' on the 'Tonight Show' when Johnny Carson returns!
progressoid
(50,785 posts)Some? SOME???
markodochartaigh
(2,221 posts)it happens so often these days that it no longer even generates much attention."
That's like saying, "We leave the guns out, and the kids shoot up the neighborhood so often that we just don't pay attention anymore."
krkaufman
(13,755 posts)I have little expectation of any followup or the continual focus (frenzy) shown towards Bidens age.
Prairie Gates
(3,536 posts)Last edited Sun Oct 6, 2024, 09:18 AM - Edit history (1)
There's no way he would have bylined this article if he thought he needed access to Trump over the next four years.
dchill
(40,741 posts)Prairie Gates
(3,536 posts)dchill
(40,741 posts)Bev54
(11,935 posts)Is on MSNBC and they are trashing his paper.
not fooled
(6,108 posts)MSNBC: Baker and Kasich.
There are more but those two come to mind now.
Prairie Gates
(3,536 posts)So sick of his Trump-explainer condescending bullshit.
senseandsensibility
(20,392 posts)Unrelated, but I have noticed that his wife Susan Glasser has been much more fair in her commentary about Dems lately, and critical of cheato. They wrote a book on cheato together I believe, so maybe they both think he'll lose.
kansasobama
(1,540 posts)Would have helped
Pototan
(2,099 posts)Remember, the Comey letter, which sunk the Clinton campaign in 2016, came out just 11 days before the election.
I think the timing on this issue may be just perfect this year.
I posted a similar article today from the Guardian. If other media outlets start carrying this message and demand Trump's medical records, his cognitive decline and age could become the most important issue leading into the vote counting day in November.
although Comeys thumb on the scale had the imprimatur of the DOJ in a Democratic administration and therefore hit like a ton of bricks.
Still, this from the NYT in the final month of the campaign is significant and may have an effect, especially if contributes to the Trump-GOP Death Spiral narrative.
Baitball Blogger
(48,385 posts)The moment the light goes on.
KS Toronado
(19,689 posts)about his mental deterioration?
Otherwise its just a tree falling in the forest🫤
Farmer-Rick
(11,532 posts)For his own good he needs to drop out of the campaign. Allowing him to become the next President of the United States is elder abuse. The filthy-rich oligarchs need to find a new psychopath to use. This one is way too old and worn out.
Trump's obvious dementia is hidden by his psychopathy. Being mean, nasty and angry hides his severely declined mental abilities. Because his anger fuels his attacks and covers his dwindling brain function.
Here is what Trump is really like, and which the filthy-rich owners of the corporate media are hiding.
Trump's brain is "So foggy, in fact, that he forgot Mr. Setoodeh himself. After interviewing Mr. Trump in May 2021, Mr. Setoodeh returned in August. When I said, Do you remember sitting down with me? he said, No, that was a long time ago, Mr. Setoodeh said. It was like we started from square one. He started telling me the exact same stories. He didnt remember what we had talked about. He didnt remember me.
That is Trump's dementia in a nutshell. This is how the very elderly with dementia behave. What's he going to tell world leaders then forget what he agreed to? Especially since we know he frequently meets with world leaders alone and there are no detailed notes of what transpired.
CrispyQ
(38,540 posts)This entire video on this DU thread is good but the stable genius really shines at 3:30.
https://democraticunderground.com/100219533706
arlyellowdog
(1,429 posts)Many are oblivious to embarrassment, but I dont see anyone being drawn to him who hasnt already been sucked in. But its good to keep saying hes senile. Thats how they got Biden.
Bev54
(11,935 posts)NOT BY THE NY TIMES. More lack of insight
Tetrachloride
(8,482 posts)Martin68
(24,701 posts)Vance will implement an entirely different, and far more dangerous, agenda when he becomes president.
central scrutinizer
(12,441 posts)Vance will work hard on implementing Project 2025
hay rick
(8,296 posts)Silent Type
(7,297 posts)Point is, this is not new. But the article is good.
PatrickforB
(15,125 posts)'Biden old, Biden old, Biden old' drumbeat.
Due to the legal doctrine of shareholder primacy, established through a MI Supreme Court ruling back in 1919 against Henry Ford in favor of the Dodge brothers, AND Reagan killing the Fairness Doctrine back in '87, the fiduciary responsibility of executives at these publicly traded 'news' organizations is ONLY to generate shareholder profits, with NOTHING...
I repeat NOTHING requiring them to report the truth...
virtually all of the reporting we get from ABC (Disney), CBS (Paramount), NBC (Comcast), NYT (Ochs-Sulzberger), CNN (Warner Brothers Discovery) is ALWAYS going to be BIASED in such a way as to generate and maximize shareholder PROFITS.
This is why we have a 'horserace' folks. It is better for PROFITS.
This is why Trump is being 'sanewashed'. It is better for PROFITS.
This is why all the lies he and Vance tell are being glossed over. Again better for PROFITS.
And finally, it is why X, Fox and other right-wing 'news' sources keep their audience is a complete bubble of conspiracy theories. Because they can (no Fairness Doctrine) and because it is good for PROFITS.
There are two major PROFIT centers here:
1. Ad revenue based on ratings, and
2. Campaign ads - due to Citizens United, we have THE most EXPENSIVE political campaigns in the world. Billions of dollars.
You want to change that?
One little rule-change in corporate governance - instead of the interests of shareholders being held above everything else, we could require an expansion of the fiduciary responsibility of media executives (and every other corporate officer in a publicly traded company) to consider the interests of workers, consumers (including truth in news reporting), and the environment EQUALLY with the interests of shareholders. A stakeholder approach to corporate governance.
If we had our members of Congress legislate that, as well as making the changes required in the Supreme Court so they are no longer so partisan, and if we ENFORCED this new rule of corporate governance, we would save the republic for years to come.
Oh, and let's not forget legislation that reverses the most recent Supreme Court rulings - Dobbs, the ruling against Chevron, and Citizens United.
Then the billionaire parasites would have to play their 'long game' again to undermine the republic. Heck, with any luck it would take them fifty or sixty years to get us to the stage we're at now - the verge of a fascist dictatorship.
Oh, I know it is wonky. And as an experiment, if you have read this far, please either 'rec' this post or reply. Most people won't, I know because policy is BORING. This is why we've been so thoroughly fucked by Wall Street and the billionaire parasites. You know that, right? Look at Project 2025. BOR-ING!!! But if they put it in place, our republic will be history.
peggysue2
(11,510 posts)While everyone in the world has observed Trump's cognitive decline, the NYTs and Peter Baker pretends it wasn't obvious in comparison to Biden's frailty.
The former president has not been hobbled politically by his age as much as Mr. Biden was, in part because the incumbent comes across as physically frail while Mr. Trump still exudes energy.
Really? Or maybe it's because the NYTs wrote endless articles about Biden's physical frailty equating the physical with the cognitive and extending the Republican narrative/drumbeat.
Or Trump's vocabulary is at a 4th grade level.
A 2022 study by a pair of University of Montana scholars found that Mr. Trumps speech complexity was significantly lower than that of the average president over American history. (So was Mr. Bidens.) The Times analysis found that Mr. Trump speaks at a fourth-grade level, . . .
The parenthetical is a must because bothsiderism is a must in all things.
Then the quotes by Trump's inner circle denying the problem or if there is an admission it's about losing his fastball or edge or whatever.
So, yes the NYTs has finally admitted the obvious: Trump is a loon and has tipped into Never-Never Land.
My favorite line was Silence of the Lip. That was a bloop I hadn't heard before.
Overall? I stand by my subscription cancellation.
bif
(24,222 posts)Pototan
(2,099 posts)I may disagree with some of what they print (or don't print) but I know if they focus on an issue, they carry more weight than other print media.
Especially love the Sunday edition! I think they tend to report both sides of issues. I think that's more important than being a biased news source.
Amaryllis
(9,830 posts)constitution that addresses if the presidential candidate is found unfit before the election? If that would even happen...
JustAnotherGen
(33,776 posts)Too late.
Needs to be front and center every single day.
republianmushroom
(18,123 posts)even for the news media. But no very little call for medical records.
dalton99a
(84,818 posts)Similarly, he uses 32 percent more negative words than positive words now, compared with 21 percent in 2016, which can be another indicator of cognitive change. And he uses swearwords 69 percent more often than he did when he first ran, a trend that could reflect what experts call disinhibition. (A study by Stat, a health care news outlet, produced similar findings.)
Mr. Trump frequently reaches to the past for his frame of reference, often to the 1980s and 1990s, when he was in his tabloid-fueled heyday. He cites fictional characters from that era like Hannibal Lecter from Silence of the Lip (he meant Silence of the Lambs), asks wheres Johnny Carson, bring back Johnny (who died in 2005) and ruminates on how attractive Cary Grant was (the most handsome man). He asks supporters whether they remember the landing in New York of Charles Lindbergh, who actually landed in Paris and long before Mr. Trump was born.
He seems confused about modern technology, suggesting that most people dont have any idea what the hell a phone app is in a country where 96 percent of people own a smartphone. If sometimes he seems stuck in the 1990s, there are moments when he pines for the 1890s, holding out that decade as the halcyon period of American history and William McKinley as his model president because of his support for tariffs.
BlueWavePsych
(3,056 posts)Hekate
(95,203 posts)LetMyPeopleVote
(155,388 posts)Trueblue1968
(18,249 posts)Shoonra
(567 posts)I suspect that Vance is riding hard to get Trump and himself elected because of Trump's mental decline. Vance's secret plan: Once he's VP, the 25th Amendment will be invoked to declare Trump unable to discharge his duties properly, and thus make Vance the Acting President. So by re-electing Trump we are actually electing Vance to fill the Oval Office.
LetMyPeopleVote
(155,388 posts)RidinWithHarris
(790 posts)...it's not enough.
Joinfortmill
(16,603 posts)usonian
(14,512 posts)Maga nominees?
They're creepy and they're kooky,
Mysterious and spooky,
They're altogether ooky,
The maga nominees.
They've got a proposition
That's not of your volition
THE SPANISH INQUISITION
The maga nominees
[snap twice]
(Addicted)
[snap twice]
(Conflicted)
[snap twice]
(Convicted)
Oh, Donald!
You're gonna need a cohort
To sneak you through an airport
As agents seize your passport
When you decide to flee.
Rocknation
(44,885 posts)The real question is, will Don Jr. become Vance's new running mate?
Rocknation
usonian
(14,512 posts)But I am saving up pennies to donate for a T---- memorial.
Celebration.
LearnedHand
(4,221 posts)Here let me fix that for you: "it no longer even generates much attention at the NYT, and we seldom wrote about it anyway."
Richard D
(9,423 posts). . . that they want to win the election on trump, then he will be retired and we will have president Vance.
Now i need a drink,
ShazamIam
(2,723 posts)"they," are trying to kill me and the Democratic are all evil and trying to destroy this nation.
Emile
(30,661 posts)Hstch05
(225 posts)to a sit down interview with the Times? Apparently the fact that Biden didn't do one made the publisher so butthurt that they started focusing on the age issue more and more.
4lbs
(7,395 posts)sit-down with the NYT?
aggiesal
(9,513 posts)Aussie105
(6,447 posts)After that, it is a slow decline to intellectual death, if not physical death.
How slow or fast is that decline?
Depends on genetics, your environment, your diet, how well you take care of yourself.
Being overweight and careless about diet and drugs plus a family history of going 'weird' just hastens things.
Most of us though, in our declining years, won't be aware of it. That is the sad thing.
But Trump - should have retired from public life about 20 years ago, before his mental disintegration became too obvious.
Alas, too many people found him a useful idiot. Or thought he was.
Response to Pototan (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
D23MIURG23
(3,095 posts)The NYTimes can fuck itself.
malaise
(278,668 posts)LetMyPeopleVote
(155,388 posts)TFG has been declining for some time. His speeches are now twice as long with a large amount of nonsense and material that does not make sense. The NYT has finally done an article on TFG's dementia and decline
Link to tweet
https://www.rawstory.com/donald-trump-age-2669337188/
The reporter conducted an analysis of the former president's rally speeches dating back to 2015 and found that they had nearly doubled in length, from 45 minutes eight years ago to 82 minutes now. And they show clear signs of advancing age and diminishing mental capacity.
"It's not new that Donald Trump is a discursive speaker, that he rambles, that he says things that are outrageous, that he says things that are untrue, that he seems to at times be disconnected from the norms, the standards that we are used to," Baker told MSNBC's Morning Joe.
"We see the speeches getting longer, more rambling," Baker added. "They're nearly twice as long today as they were in 2016. At the same time he's doing far fewer of them. Does that mean he's tired? We don't know. Obviously, we remember he nodded off during his hush money trial. He's doing less than one quarter of the rallies so far this year than he did in 2016, so I think it's appropriate to look at age."