I cleaned it up.

everything is up for grabs now

We can't just surrender.

It has nothing to do with the military being too woke and everything to do with getting rid of all the top generals who are loyal to the Constitution rather than just personally loyal to Trump and anything he wants to do.

Trump had to physically leave office in 2021 because had he tried to remain, the military would have removed him. He is now planning ahead to 2028 and seeing that current leaders will follow the law and not his every illegal act. If he replaces current leaders with people who swear allegiance only to him, they will not remove him when he declares himself president for life in 2028. Trump has already corrupted the courts and he has the next four years to further corrupt them. Congressional Republicans are now mostly Trump sycophants like Tuberville and Johnson who will do anything Trump demands of them, legal or not. The DOJ will become Trump’s personal Stasi. The only group lacking is the military, and I think he has a plan to corrupt it also.

livid

Last edited Thu Nov 14, 2024, 02:34 AM - Edit history (2)

Hope this famous line (from the poem, To a Mouse) doesn't become reality instead in 2028.

"The best-laid plans of mice and men often go awry."

Never bring only a knife to a gunfight.
.

Neither of those candidates would get completely frozen out of the Blue Wall, I’d be willing to bet!

Which can probably help him a lot if he were the nominee

The non-election *election* ?

Run another woman. Michigan is okay with a woman Governor- but not a woman President. They told America their truth.

Yes, very sad..but we must pick a candidate that can win, and when we do, we can pick the fight back up. A woman candidate is not an option in this country right now unless you want to lose.

It’s just not a particularly good argument.

Looking to 2028 and trying to figure out who the likely republican candidate is the only person, right now IMO, is Nikki Haley. She's an ex-governor, ex- U.N. Ambassador, very articulate, and attractive.

I think Governor Gretchen Whitmer is a good match and someone who could defeat Haley.

he man woman haters club is in charge of this country.

Someone like Whitmer could win.

and twice a bunch of people stayed home.

Misogyny. It is what our country is. You can reject it all you want, but look at what's happening now....they want to remove all of the hard-fought rights women have gained. No-fault divorce is going to be ended, there will be a national abortion ban in a few months, and there is talk by the right wing of removing our right to vote.

And you still think that they would vote for a woman? Okay. I disagree.

And the leaders of the party are likely to move to the right, to be Republican lite.

It was a tough cycle, Biden had a sub 40% approval rating.

Harris couldn’t break away from that, and incumbents just don’t win in those conditions, even good candidates, which Harris was not.

I don’t think there are universal lessons from two candidates.

election, it probably won't be a question that gets answered.

And running towards the bottom of the pack in the 2020 primaries. She's never been a viable nationwide candidate.

I don’t subscribe to the “a woman can’t win” mantra. It was the electoral college issue that prevented her from winning, not because of the lack of votes due to misogyny.

He's a great debater too (Harris was a good debater, but she had the advantage of going against a terrible debater). Going against the likely nominee Vance, I really hope it's Gavin.

of the same weaknesses as Harris. He's a guy/

would be my choice... I think Gavin is too far left and GOP will campaign against him like they did Harris.

You are kidding, right?

Biden was forced out because of the perception that he could not speak, was cognitively impaired. And you are suggesting a similar candidate?

Gov Whitmer would make a wonderful President. But this country recently chose a grotesque convicted felon against two highly qualified women already. Even machista Mexico inaugurated a woman President less than a month ago.

Fetterman? I already told you why that does not make sense.

Shapiro? Yeah, he would be great. Would the Maga America we just saw last week agree?

Look, I know we are all hurting right now but, c'mon, too soon for suggestions that are sure losers.

My own personal favorite--Pete Buttigieg. Do you think current America would elect him? I don't.

Shapiro--the country is not ready for a Jewish President.

Whitmer--the country is not ready for a woman President.

Fetterman--the country is not ready for someone who speaks like Joe Biden.

Not my opinion. But we leave in Trump's America now.

You gonna kick me out?

Did you see what happened on election day?

He gave his opinion and that’s ok

Whittmer is my favorite, but we have demonstrated two times now that we will not elect a woman in the general. I expect we will not elect a female candidate in the primary for a while going forward, given that negative experience.

Fetterman is a non-starter given his multiple health issues, after what happened with Biden dropping out in the eleventh hour (and IMHO being one of the primary reasons we lost.) He can stay where he is.

I don't know anything about Shapiro and wouldn't vote for him in the primary. But if he wins the primary, I would support him.

Despite the fact that he is overqualified.

So was St. Ronnie for that matter.

I didn't pay much attention to him before. Maybe
I will now....

he knows what everyone got wrong. It looks like he is starting his run already, I don't care for him.

But he is also a governor from a small, mostly rural, Republican state. He would have no name recognition.

No thanks

I believe we're better than this and hope that we do not move to the right and accept being defined by lunatic Trump.

Human rights and civil rights reduced to "wok"? Examining every aspect of our losses must be taken seriously instead of deciding we lost because we only care about trans people, especially the kids!

This is obnoxious:
Villard told HuffPost on Tuesday that Newsom just might work for Democrats in 2028 because Americans love to vote for an attractive white man. And Newsom has a striking resemblance to Tony Goldwyn, who played President Fitzgerald Grant on the TV show “Scandal,” something several social media users also pointed out. Newsom also has a sort of Patrick Bateman from “American Psycho” vibe to him, too, which, after it was revealed young men largely voted for Trump, could help gain the young male vote.


Nov. 7, 2023

SACRAMENTO — Gov. Gavin Newsom’s standing among California voters has hit an all-time low, with 49% disapproving of his performance as governor, according to a new UC Berkeley Institute of Governmental Studies poll co-sponsored by the Los Angeles Times.
https://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2023-11-07/new-poll-finds-california-voters-disapprove-newsom-performance-governor

Newsom's low popularity is normal for a second-term governor. He'll leave office in 2027 giving him one year to put together a campaign for the Democratic Party nomination. Among the things Newsom needs to do in California first are:

1. Effectively deal with the homeless problem. I don't know how he'll do this because there are so many homeless people and the lack of affordable house is one of the reasons for homelessness.

2. Tackle the lack of affordable housing. This too is hard because housing costs are a results of supply and demand, something the governor has little to no control over.

3. He needs to find new revenue sources without increasing taxes or fees to balance the budget and increase the state's reserves.

4. One issue most people North of San Diego haven't heard of is the international border sewer spillage crisis. There are two sewer treatment plants, one in the U.S. and one in Tijuana, that have been broken and dumping millions of gallons of raw sewage into the ocean. That sewage has flowed northward along the San Diego coast forcing the closures of ocean beaches and beaches in San Diego Bay. The city of Imperial bBeach, which borders Medico, has had their beach closed for over 1,000 days. The Navy Seals training center is adjacent to Imperial Beach and the Seal trainees train in these polluted waters. While the federal government and the Mexican government have provided money to begin the process of repairing/replacing the plants Newsom hasn't yet declared it a disaster area which would prod the federal government to step up faster.

California is a large state with the largest population and no matter how many problems the state has, the republicans will point to these problems and blow them out of proportion. Newsom has to step up his actions to boost is image as someone who can solve problems.

He’s too good for this country.

I want whomever can get the White House back for us.

Unless we can get back in the game with the media, we will lose. The rightwing controls and owns the media, both traditional and social.

that will win. At this particular moment, I don't see a candidate in sight that would manage to overcome a rigged election. We have lost our democracy. Or maybe that ship sailed long before this one. I think it's been chipped away state by state, and somehow the fascists have finally taken over again, but this time with a vengeance I don't see how we come out of this.
Not that we shouldn't try, we have to fight back, but not by floating the next candidate at this juncture.

This is just one example but in my blue county, we have hand counted ballots that are never attached to the internet. Democrats oversee our elections. Guess what? Our county shifted 5% towards Trump. I imagine this happened all over the country.

I have yet to spend time researching the data figures comparing registered Dems who turned out to vote, and where did those votes go or comparisons to the California primary last spring, and previous election years. If the reports I've been hearing about are true, in general, it was a significantly lower turnout from registered Dems nationwide. Not sure if that is the situation in California. I haven't had the time to research it yet. It would be informative to some degree once that is published.

But the bottom line, is that Reich Wing Thugs are poisoning our water metaphorically speaking, and they are gaining ground. Very demoralizing, which is also what they are counting on.

unless it is rigged, let alone a 2028 election.

Trump told the truth when he said that if he won we wouldn't have to vote again.

I'm not an alarmist, but it feels like these fuckers are SERIOUS about establishing one-party rule, Putin-style.

doesn't want to be California. Besides that we already have California's vote, we need someone that
can carry the battleground states. That is just one of the reasons we lost this time, besides being a women
and black she was from California.

You know what? Pacific coastals probably had enough. Let us not fall for this. If we keep mistreating CA, CA should threaten to secede. Why not? TX says that. CA is the world's 7th largest economy. Without CA, USA is nothing. CA helps red state freeloaders. CA is capable of threatening and extracting concessions from Trump without really seceding. Of course, it depends on how bad it gets. Noem is a good start.

The only thing that will save us is an effective pushback by Pacific states for the next 4 years. Whitmer from Michigan would lose miserably. Not because she is bad. Our nation is sexist.

to play nationally. Shoplifting $1000 with no consequences, the cost of living, homeless everywhere, reperations and the gangs.
You won't get western PA with that.

Right now theft of anything over $950 is a felony and anything under $950 is a misdemeanor. You can still get 6 months jail for a misdemeanor. I sat on a jury last year here in Southern California for a misdemeanor criminal case and we convicted the guy.

Also, we just passed a ballot initiative on Nov. 5 that makes shoplifting less than $950 a felony if you have priors. https://apnews.com/article/california-ballot-propositions-2024-election-7e6c94f6d4d1f5660af1e4f326bd03ff

Same with your other accusations. Homelessness is a problem everywhere in the country, especially in expensive rent places like CA. Newsom is clearing out homeless encampments, resulting in criticism by housing advprior. I guess for Newsom, it's damned if you do, damned if you don't. Newsom does not support reparations. That is not even a possibility in CA. Newsom officially apologized for slavery, but refused other measures. https://calmatters.org/politics/capitol/2024/09/california-reparations-slavery-apology/

Gangs are no more of a problem here than anywhere is. Violent crime is way down in CA. The violent crime rate was 511 per 100,000 in 2023, less than half the 1992 peak of 1,104.
https://calbudgetcenter.org/resources/crime-in-california-remains-well-below-historical-peaks/#:~:text=The%20violent%20crime%20rate%20was,at%20historic%20lows%20in%20California. 1992 also happened to be the last time we had a REPUBLICAN governor (Pete Wilson).

It absolutely sucks that we are losing the messaging war so bad that even Dems on DU believe the right wing lies--and amplify them here on DU. Shameful.

when anyone even says California. If those things are not true I guess it is the messaging thing.

You said "it's politics are too liberal." That's just not true.

It's been with candidates from California, New York and Massachusetts.

Our candidates will at best barely win. I dont know why the Democratic party cant see this. Republicans spent years learning from Russia and even Hungary how to use misinformation to keep the people in the dark and keep single party control over the country

One thing we could have done is rein in the many preachers who told their flocks to vote for Trump. That is actually illegal if they're tax-exempt, but it isn't enforced, so they had no fear of any consequences. Biden should have ordered the IRS to vigorously enforce the Johnson Amendment and yank their tax-exempt status. Now Trump et al. will do away with it altogether.

And get it over with then. I don't think Newsom has any chance of winning.

I could be wrong, and the political landscape could be different in 4 years, but I don't know what about the last 8 years tells us that the country is looking for a California liberal elitist to be president. It seems like people are looking for more of an outsider.

Even going back to 2008, I think the fact that Obama was someone with limited political experience actually helped him. Though he is of course exceptionally charismatic as well.

If Trump's policies are as disastrous as we think they will be, we might be able to run a ham sandwich and win. But we shouldn't assume that voters will even be aware of it. They apparently were not aware of most of what he said this cycle.

I'm hoping for someone to come along that is essentially the second coming of Teddy Roosevelt. Someone seen as strong and charismatic, with progressive but relatively centrist policies who can plausibly distance themselves from some of the less popular policies/ideas coming from the left in recent years.

as some hippie extremist soft on crime, so what chance would Newsom have?
He wouldn't.

It would be too easy for Republicans to pillory Newsom as an out-of-touch coastal liberal and emphasize his failure to address California’s problems with drugs, homelessness and cost of living.

We’re currently in another Gilded Age when ultra wealthy interests have gotten out of control, and Newsom does not pretend to want to stand up to those interests. Look at how he caved on the California Journalism Preservation Act.

As for the conservative white men that HuffPo delusionally plans to win over — all they know about Newsom is that he locked down his state during COVID and then went to fancy dinner parties in Napa while the plebes suffered.

The Covid/French Laundry debacle would be running on Fox in a loop in the Midwest and Newsome would be portrayed as a west coast liberal elitist. If we learn anything from this election, it should be the need to bring the blue- collar working man vote back to the Democratic party and Newsome is not the candidate to do that, especially if running against Vance. Fetterman stands out as someone who could accomplish that and would play well in Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania, which as we have seen can be the key to gaining the white house.

A little too lab grown for me. Give me a Beshear after he develops a bit more polish.

He has a weird Kenneth the Page / Bobby Jindal sort of vocal pattern that is a weak negative, but when he gets started on issues of justice and fairness, the dude flares up. You can see where his core is. During the Veepstakes I thought he was just a little too new...

MR

And Gavin Newsome will not win the rustbelt.

I just don't see it.

He just leaves me feeling empty and vapid, to be honest. I've never really been all that impressed by him.

Either Wes Moore or Pete Buttigieg in 2028...assuming we have free and fair elections.

We don’t have to be in love with our candidate , just a support them because they are a strong dem, which Newsom has been…every step of the way.

As far as talking to donors, building infrastructure, a network, etc. Not too early. And he's term limited, he's going to be looking for his next job.

...

is a California liberal?

Someone tell the mostly white male geniuses telling us that's the reason.

I honestly don't see any point in fighting. MAYBE I'll vote again, but without any enthusiasm that things will work out in our favor.

No Dem from CA, NY or MA will get elected president for a very long time. And this is no offense (I'm a native of CA) to those states, at all. Lots of very good Dem politicians from each. Including Harris and Newsom. And right now, I have no idea who will rise to top for us to consider. Actually more concerned about the immediate future to worry about it for now.

Obama...Illinois
Clinton...Arkansas
Carter...Georgia

Biden is from Delaware, but touted his roots in PA more than anything. And Delaware is not viewed in the same prism as California or Massachusetts.

The presidency runs through the rust belt or South.

THAT will be a fun talking point.

You have to realize there is a good chance we may never have a fair election. Trump can rig the mid-terms. Victor Orban is his ideal. Dems really need to get over the dream of normalcy. It is time for a resistance for the Pacific States who are the only ones that can withstand pressure from Washington. Otherwise, our nation will die. Matt Gaetz as AG? Do you have any doubts we are done?

he's already been branded by the right. I know some super low info voters who didn't immediately recognize the name, but when I mentioned that he's the governor of CA, they instantly spewed maga-like talking points about how Newsom destroyed California.

That said, Newsom has been smart about things, making frequent appearances on fnc--so rightwingers know him and they might even respect him.

Why are democrats continuing to waste energy discussing candidates for future elections, it’s a pointless conversation, focus should be on the here and now

No body should be put forth anyway , to be smeared and lied about for the next four years.

Any candidate has to earn the nomination.

Annointing kings and queens is what got us here.

Listen and learn.

The Democratic Party has never anointed a King or a Queen. That would be the REPUBLICAN Party who does that.

We got hosed because our party did that. I voted for Biden in the primary and I bet all of you did too, and then they pulled a switcharoo on us... and that sucked. Look at how much he did in 4 years, making our country stronger than its been in decades, and think about what he could have done with another 4. We had this in the bag.

As soon as Biden was out and Harris was in, all the MAGAts started their knee-jerk braying "OMG the dems r HIPPOCRITES!!11 She gOt ZeRo PrimAry Votes bUt They Want to Save DemOcracY!!!!1 LOL" and guess what, enough people we might have won over before listened to that and here we are. Our own party made us look disorganized and without a plan at the last minute and gave the fascists just enough ammo to pull off a win. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot

That said, I was still hopeful and excited for the first Black woman president and I cast my ballot proudly. Instead of another white man in 2028 (no offense to Mr. Newsome), I really want to see the first Black Transwoman president just to watch the stupid MAGAts heads explode.

When we voted for him, we voted for Kamala.

The polls showed Biden losing badly to Trump. Because of right wing propaganda! That's why he stepped aside for his backup to take over.

Alas, we could not overcome the right wing propaganda. Hell, many of us here repeat that poison.

He's smart, a shrewd political player and he absolutely lives to fuck with Trumpers...

If he runs it will be "We dont want no Commifornia librul runnin the USA" 24 fucking 7

yes, i'm quite certian he's qualified, but the RW will have a field day with it

At this point, realizing the importance of the 2028 election, I prefer either Roy Cooper of North Carolina or Andy Boshear of Kentucky. They are both governors who could compete in a few Southern states and still be appealing to voters in the battleground states. And of course, the Democratic candidate--whoever it is--will be chosen by voters after going through what should be a very competitive primary process.

Certainly, Josh Shapiro of Pennsylvania is another who comes to mind at this point.

But many things can and will happen in the meantime.

Nope, NFW