General Discussion
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Link to tweet
The Dems not understanding this is partly why we lost.
dalton99a
(84,257 posts)Just stick with economic issues and focus on economic issues
Keepthesoulalive
(575 posts)Minorities , immigrants, environmentalists and so many others vote for democrats.
People were fed propaganda from the right wing and legacy media. Focusing on the economy only will not fire up the base. The democrats are great for the economy but the media went for the circus not the truth. We must include everyone but the maga.
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)Reality check for a few special interest groups.
karynnj
(59,935 posts)On guns and abortion, the public was with us.
On Israel, the chart ASSIGNS the Hamas side as blue. In fact, Biden and Harris were vocal in support of Israel and the administration led 2 efforts to protect Israel from Hamas. Harris won the Jewish vote at normal Democratic levels.
The other things show that the Republican have made trans issues a winning issue for them. However, no Democrat MADE this the issue.
America has long had a strong xenophobic undercurrent that clearly was used by Trump and Vance. They gave white Christian supremacists the permission to come out in public. We did not make that the issue, but had to respond to some degree.
What Biden and Harris made the biggest issues were the economy and democracy. The former did not work because to too many people 2024 was harder economically for them than memories of 2017 thru 2019. The fact that the economy recovered better than any other country and than any expert projections did not convince people who felt things were worse.
On democracy, it may be that people leaning to or on the other side saw "democracy" to mean voting for their side to be in power. The fear we, I still believe legitimately, felt that Trump winning could end democracy was rejected by them. Sadly, the election may show many bought Trump's lie that his legal problems were persecution - even though the fraud proven in his business preceded his first team.
Vegan4life
(8 posts)But I don't think the Democratic party wants to acknowledge or accept it.
Lonestarblue
(11,814 posts)The majority of progressives have supported Israels right to exist for decades. Yes, some progressives support Palestinians right to have their country, following the 1948 plan, but most progressives support Israel also. As a progressive, I do not support Netanyahu and his right-wing government because I think their war on Hanas has been waged without concern for civilians, and I support international law that is intended to prevent an occupier from resettling its own citizens in occupied territory , as Israel is doing in the West Bank.
Mosby
(17,454 posts)Progressives think that Jews stole the land from Arabs.
peregrinus
(196 posts)Are stealing Palestinian land.
Mosby
(17,454 posts)And Canada, and Australia.
Right?
peregrinus
(196 posts)Jews were always the minority in Palestine until Israel was created and neo-colonial practices created a Jewish majority. You clearly believe that Jews have a right to that land by force.
DeepWinter
(466 posts)everywhere has been taken by force at one time or another. Dozens of times. Dozens of dozens of times. National boundaries, regional boundaries, tribal boundaries have ebbed and flowed since we picked up a rock and club. This idea of "we want our land back" is laughable. History is arguing over land the last 7,000 years, and you really only "own" it while you can defend it with your blood.
Mosby
(17,454 posts)And Arabs are indigenous to the Arabian Peninsula.
Arabs conquered MENA via killing and raping and pillaging. Why else is Egypt, Morocco, Libya, Tunisia Muslim?
Where did Jordan come from?
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)Lessons learned that the party is in a bit of a bubble. That needs to change.
Keepthesoulalive
(575 posts)They told the most egregious lies about others and dumb asses believed them. They made up false issues to fire up lizards brains and that nonsense worked. So we should just focus on economics as they put many Americans in harms way. No thank you.
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)W_HAMILTON
(8,489 posts)The other poster was absolutely correct -- or do you honestly think those issues you mentioned were some sort of major central plank of the Democratic platform this year?
RJ_MacReady
(441 posts)Its irrelevant if it was part of the platform. A large segment of voters believed it was. And our party did nothing to counter it which lead to people to think it was true.
W_HAMILTON
(8,489 posts)Spend more time talking about this non-issue than talking about issues that actually impact the lives of everyday Americans?
Be virulently anti-trans like most Republicans?
People who thought this was some big campaign issue already have their """perceptions""" cemented by rightwing propaganda and no one has found a way to overcome that bullshit. If people choose to believe lies over truth, how exactly do you counter that? Tell us.
RJ_MacReady
(441 posts)Those anti trans ads during football were very effective. The clip of Kamala talking about gender care for inmates angered a lot of people. Our position should be this is best kept at the local level between the parties involved.
W_HAMILTON
(8,489 posts)And that is our position.
If, in this case, a small segment of voters, are going to believe Republican lies over Democrats, what makes you believe that there is anything Democrats can do to change that, much less actually win their vote?
RJ_MacReady
(441 posts)And it isn't a small segment. Look at what Seth Moulton said.
W_HAMILTON
(8,489 posts)...not because there are millions across the nation dealing with the rampant problems of trans athletes.
And what about Seth Moulton? The fact you are bringing up a Democrat criticizing trans people goes against your narrative. And his comments are not going to win over one Republican vote that thinks this is some big issue, but he might lose some LGBT votes. So how does that help us?
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)Then they should have the space to answer freely without fear of cancellation from special interest groups.
But hey stay in the bubble. Its working great! If we just ignore and write off everyone who doesnt see eye to eye with us we will surely win the next cycle. We just have to ignore them a little harder and weve got it!
W_HAMILTON
(8,489 posts)...and I suppose your recommendation on how to handle that is have Democrats knife them in the back as well? Where do the knives stop at? Gay people? Black people? Women? Who are you willing to not throw under the bus to win over bigoted voters that were never going to vote for Democrats anyway because they are WILLINGLY inundated with anti-Democratic propaganda everyday by the rightwing bullshit they listen to?
And who's in the bubble here? How many trans people have you met in real life? Are trans people competing in sports a big issue where you live?
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)Everything we do is perfect. Its the voters that are the morons.
W_HAMILTON
(8,489 posts)If they believe that children are hopping on the bus as Ricky and coming back Lucy and that immigrants are stealing American pets and eating them -- are you telling me that's not fucking absolutely moronic?
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)And youve hit on a great strategy for 2028. Our candidates should tell the voters how stupid they are, but in a nice way.
Keepthesoulalive
(575 posts)And comes home hes Lucy had a sex change operation in school.
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)Keepthesoulalive
(575 posts)Republicans did along with eating the family pet, theyre coming for your guns, dont say woke and many more things to demonize others and if the democrats wont speak up in our defense why should we volunteer donate and vote. Women are dying because they cant get the medical care they need and he joked about it.
Elessar Zappa
(15,888 posts)Are there really one issue voters out there that vote Republican just because of the sports debate?
BannonsLiver
(17,980 posts)There are voters who make decisions on a wide array of issues that dont make any sense to us, but alas, they do it anyway.
peregrinus
(196 posts)What Ritchie Torres has to say
Of course you don't.
peregrinus
(196 posts)SidDithers
(44,266 posts)Sid
ThePartyThatListens
(87 posts)Progressives don't hate Israel.
He sounds identical to a run-of-the-mill Republican spewing that crap
I hope his constituents are paying attention.
In It to Win It
(9,589 posts)the chat. The economic progressive issues they never want to talk about.
Instead, he wants to frame "progressivism" as this bullshit that nobody runs on. He's doing the rightwing media's job for them. He bought their bullshit.