We have a media and politicians that read scripts they are given by republicans and the wealthy. Any truth has to be searched through a lot of garbage. The push back is given by people like Donna Brazille who is often busy referring to her TV husband, as she jokingly calls Chris Christy, while the host allows republican's the last word to spew their lies with no rebuttal.

they just didn't care.

I know a few like that, and these are not illiterate people, most of them have completed college, and some of them have master degrees, they just didn't care. There is also the fact that you can have people who studied in College, have Master degrees, PHDs, are good in business but are very politically ignorant. That is some of the people I know.

Some live with their religion 24/7, they are listening to the gospel every day, they go everywhere with their bible, meet weekly with a "prayer group" whose only information source is Fox News, and whatever their equally ideological friends send them via WhatsApp.

Was it Karl Max who said that "Religion is the opium of the masses"? He may have had something there.

Yes it was:
Marx studied the function of religion in people' s everyday realities and concluded metaphorically that 'religion is the opium of the masses'.

DISCLAIMER: I am not trying to offend anyone who is tight with their religion, just pointing out how the people I know feed their brains with misinformation, and it just happens that 99% of it comes from the religious groups, and their decisions are all based on religion.

everything he had done. He was appointed by their god.

they all tell everyone about their god of "love" and then vote for someone who is the literal embodiment of everything that their book says is evil.

it's kind of funny, if I believed in religion, well, he'd be their anti-christ. He ticks all the boxes and then some.

Correct information is readily available and easy to find. It is a failure of morality and character to embrace and wallow in misinformation as so many do.

We have become a nation of self centered bad children.

Ignorance is the eternal enemy of democracy.

And, in the past, this was true in certain locations. But, in this day and age? Come on now. Tribes in Africa are herding goats while listening to Ke$ha on their iPads. Eskimos are playing Switch in their igloos.

There is no excuse for being this ignorant. Not anymore.

that correct information is readily available and easy to find.

I do agree that Google has made most things readily available and easy to find, but that doesn't mean it is "correct."

That doesn't mean one can find Google censored things. Who is Google to censor what I read about any subject?

Are you saying that those who go to libraries and read books about subjects censored from Google are "failures of morality and character" ?

Are you really unaware of censorship online and that large Tech Companies are herding people into groups and group think?

Your post is a very good example of why the Democrats lost.

because too many Democrats do not seem to recognize what they are dealing with when it comes to the current American electorate (namely a large portion being intellectually and morally defunct), and so do not communicate with or manipulate them as effectively as the Repugs do.

The sources that give disinformation also tell their viewers that other sources are not to be trusted.
So, you are correct that it's up to each to find the true information, but not all are told to "consider the source" as I was at a young enough age to take that to heart.

The propaganda is the problem. It has always been the problem. And right now we're fighting a propaganda war with table knives while they've got rocket launchers and sub machine guns. It's way past time to turn the tables on the right wing propagandists.

the evil has been so persuasive that it has anesthetized the more ignorant masses, thoroughly turning them against Democracy and democratic institutions. And the evil lies Murdoch has been spreading in the minds of 10s of millions of our citizens is made worse, made more destructive and effective by Murdoch's de facto alliance with Putin and his clones.

What the Democrats need to do is somehow counter the leprous propaganda on the MAGA Right with Good Propaganda,
propaganda that rebuild the public's confidence in the institutions of freedom and decency with truth. This is not going to happen as long as our journalists try to normalize the fascist craziness that Trump and his cohorts represent.

But "Good Propaganda" involves identifying evil for what it is, in identifying MAGA, the single most divisive force in America, for what it is, and for identifying Trump as its principal leader, as an admirer of dictatorships, as a failed businessman, felon, and sexual abuser who scorns the very notion that America is/was a nation of laws, not men.

Dammit, we need journalists to go after the bastards every day -- and a media that gives them the ability to do just that.

Huxley was a brilliant man.

It works for both sides, but the Republicans use it much more often and more effectively. The more extreme the comment, especially criticism, the more it makes the news. One example in the last campaign where Democrats used it effectively and then backed off: When Democrats and Kamala attacked Trump as a threat to democracy, the GOP went wild in attempt to suppress it, McConnell himself called it dangerous rhetoric.

The press can and will use bothsiderism always, so that must be accounted for as well in any public statement.

No one does.

If they thought you couldn't win with lies, they wouldn't have ever begun their decades-long war on """mainstream media,""" which they then supplanted with their own conservative-slanted media.

Last edited Wed Nov 20, 2024, 06:17 PM - Edit history (1)

are the Achilles' heels of democracy.
In the US about one third of the electorate are so apathetic that they can't be bothered to vote against an authoritarian Strong Leader as long as they get their hamberders and sportsball.
And ignorance of politics is widely considered a virtue on Mainstreet USA.

Edit: I see that the response that someone made to my point was removed. While I didn't agree completely with what the other person said, I think that it is great that we can have conversations here, even when we disagree. I don't know the circumstances of the removal. But I would hope that any reply to a post of mine, as long as it didn't break forum rules, would be kept in place.
Again, conditional on the reason for removal, I would like to thank the person who responded for giving a thoughtful and considered response.

isn't free. Seem as if there are a lot of people that don't want to pay for the content so they get what they pay for.

When you are the product it isn't going to add value to your life...

Most worthless bunch of Americans we've ever had.

The line comes when José Ferrer comes into the ball room while the crew is celebrating their win in the court-martial case. (Ferrer is their attorney, for those who do not know the film. If you have never seen it, you should. Major performances from everyone in the cast.) He is berating the crew for not helping the captain instead of demanding that he be relieved of command, thus creating the mutiny charge. He turns to the assembled crew and says:

My MAGA addled sister screeched that at me 4 times in our last 'chat'.

It's mostly the same electorate that voted for Obama 2x and Biden once...

Do a better job of selling WHAT YOU WILL DO for the people...

Not a coincidence that Sanders and others have noted that the creep to the right of the modern day DEM Party have hurt the Party.

SELL A BETTER PRODUCT and do a better job SELLING IT.

They enjoy the pain. Cheeto Jesus was the most perceptive take on Trump's status to the MAGA cult.

Salvation through suffering. They enjoy pain, they are accustomed to being mentally abused, they seek more of it, hiding in plain sight.

get rid of "Obamacare" because they did not understand (or refused to acknowledge, or even ignored) that the ACA and Obamacare is the same thing!

Even the evil "concepts of a plan" lie, after NINE YEARS of its non-existence, didn't sway them, and now they're crying online as they just realize they'll lose it, for themselves and their aging relatives...

They FA big time, then they will FO and it's on THEM, ignorant IMBECILES!

What in the world is it so hard to understand: "A vote for ANY Republican is a vote against YOUR OWN "interests" once and for ALL?

Many prefer to be spoon fed conspiracy theories instead of getting on these new fangled mini computers and do basic research.

Philadelphia Inquirer piece in the OP:
https://archive.is/NFeTA#selection-673.0-677.118

Thank you for posting this!
So many are trying to point to a single policy or person or message and blame the entire loss with an extremely narrow take.

I haven't read this article specifically, but I read a similar one that stated when the policies of each party(candidate) were side by side but without labeling them as Kamala's policy vs. Trump's, most of the people polled chose the Democratic agenda.

Unfortunately, the few in the US who are hoarding the most wealth, use their money to buy newspapers, social media sites and fund the right wing propaganda machine. And also they add to voters choosing worse outcomes when they pay lobbyists to turn both parties against what's truly best for society.

Money, and especially those who have an over sized share of the wealth, will always work against what a healthy society needs to function.

Capitalism trumps democracy (pun intended)

The money interest bought out and monopolized our media. Substituting propaganda for news but still claiming it as news. Russia, Saudi and other anti democratic countries (our real enemies) helped turn our media into a vast cess pool. Because ignorance and stupidity will destroy a democracy. And it has worked.

To counter it, there needs to be a defining system to determine what is really news. Then make a steep fine to use the word "news" to label your media if it doesn't meet that criteria.

Or

Just get rid of capitalism by encouraging co-ops and worker owned businesses. Form worker's political parties, they don't have to be unions. Break up the media and other monopolies, put religion back as the Constitution says. in its place...... preferably hidden under a rock. Don't allow your judges to be bribed. And get rid of the filibuster.

Move more towards socialism and less to fascism.

We are now fascist because capitalism prefers it.

Other 25% are just assholes who know the truth but don't care.

Only my opinion; ymmv…

We're all compromised in some way simply by participating in the U.S. economy, but some of us are more compromised than others.

I've had the good fortune of being able to reject employment by people and institutions I find morally reprehensible.

My parents were artists with day jobs. My dad had a stable union job in a profession that's generally regarded as honorable. He worked for a single employer from before I was born to the day he retired. My mom worked for many people and institutions, some of whom she regarded as scum. Watching her struggle with that made a huge impression on me as a child but our family needed the money, especially since my parents had more children and larger mortgages than they could comfortably support.

Do we ever see Nicolle, Rachel, Stephanie, and Lawrence bite the hand that feeds them, other than to demand higher salaries? I don't know. I quit television news and opinion in the disgusting run-up to the war in Iraq. I quit all advertising supported television entirely in early 2012.

the most relentlessly propagandized. their ignorance in many cases is willful.

to create a news source for GOP. He made Fox News.

Social media has certainly amplified this effort.

in their description of who elected Trump.

A more accurate description below......

"Donald Trump was returned to power by chin drooling halfwits who can barely manage to wipe themselves. The most ignorant electorate in modern American history."

Success!

It’s the disinformation rather than simply the lack of info that is the main problem.

Some social media have amplified the disinformation.

can be both a blessing and a curse.

Even now online disinformation has as much if not more influence on untruths that voters ingest.

In 2021 in the emergency room of the local hospital. The male nurse was distraught about the equipment he needed not being in the room. It Walked away to another department or some such thing. We asked if things were pretty rough in there and he replied yes, many employees have simply quit because they can’t take the way they are being treated. YOU SEE WE HAVE A LOW FUNCTIONING COMMUNITY! Huh…what did you say? He went on to say that the people in our community did not understand or believe in Covid and took every bit if it out on the staff. So it seems the low functioning members of our community spoil much of what used to be nice. The conversation was certainly a surprise to us. I’ll never forget it!

And I agree with others here, that in many cases it has become willful stupidity.

They want spectacle and 24/7 entertainment, not responsible leadership. The lack of critical thinking skills has created this unbelievable fiasco that will now harm many of us.

...he is the change candidate vs. the V.P. who created this disaster (um...did Biden run against Pence in 2020)?

...he said the economy was horrible (the best economy in the world, with the lowest inflation in the world)

...inflation was 40% he said (it was actually 2.1%)

...he said he woudl bring manufacturing jobs back (he lost over 100k manufacturing jobs when he was President, thanks to the Bipartisan infrastructure Bill Biden led and signed over 800k manufacturing jobs came back from 2021-2024).

...he said he would make the U.S. "Energy Dominant" again (the US became energy independent in a way it never has, under Pres. Biden, including traditional energy sources and renewable energy-no dependence on foreign, Middle Eastern Oil)

...he lied about Haitian immigrants

...he said he would perform Mass Deportations because of the "open borders" and "border invasion" (the numbers tell a completely diff. story)

lie after lie after lie and he proved the maxim attributed to Hitler or one of his henchman, "The bigger the lie, the more people will believe it." They did...and they are experiencing the beginnings of Buyers' Remorse. I say beginnings, because, just wait, there will be a lot more Buyers' Remorse to come.

is that people get exactly the government they deserve.

The glue holding the MAGA cult together is stupidity, being uninformed, and proud of that ignorance.

They dress up at rallies like Mardi Gras revelers, oblivious that they’re adopting the gay-themed and cultural brand identities they oppose.

Dumbfucks, coupled with an electoral system reliant on anonymous money crowds out intelligent consideration of competent leaders and replaces them with cartoon-like cultural saviors and full-armed couch potatoes.

From the smallest to the largest, there must be resistance to money in politics. It is poison to the voting choice system envisioned by the founding fathers.

I’ll leave it here…

Enough of the hand wringing and self-flagellation - we had an excellent candidate and message. It just simply could not be heard above the din of the ever more sophisticated and all-pervasive DISINFORMATION intentionally planted, spread and amplified by social media AND legit news sources who feel they have to report it as "news" but in so doing, they are also helping to spread and amplify. Needs to be a whole lot more discussion on how to counteract this. It kinda presents a moral dillemma for democrats/progressives as we have chosen the ethical and truth-based high road. It needs to be emphasized that DISINFORMATION works - has been used to subjugate people since... well I dunno, nazis used it, USSR used it. How much Russia is involved in this - doesnt really matter, how to do DISINFORMATION is / has been widely known for decades.

They chose the disinformation of FOX and the right-wing, that was the propaganda arm of the GOP.

RW Propaganda is rarely behind a paywall and is ready to confirm the darkest of bias.

Real journalism is harder to find and a bother to access for most citizens.