Roof over your head and food on the table.

Fascists like to keep people in survival mode.
To teach them a lesson.

The deal then is made that as long as you have a place to sleep and food, butt out of politics.
That is the deal Putin made with the Russian people and they have agreed to that deal.

this up is to show people how it can happen and how close we could find ourselves. In actuality back in the "Red Scare" days
and during the anti-Vietnam days these things were done but not on a wide scale or in an acknowledged manner. Civil Rights activists back in the '50's and '60's had some of their experiences with being on a "list" too.

JFK, RFK, MLK were on a list too.

J Edgar had the boys making lists of political activists etc. and going around and developing "files" on them. Even before the days of Hoover the Pinkerton's and others made lists of labor activists and had their pictures when possible.

Power hungry and soulless.

St. Petersburg is the same. So much beauty after you wake up from the bus trip where the windows are hard to see through. you can't get a real glimpse of how they live and what it looks like out the window. The train only takes you at night and they lock your entire car down so there is nowhere to see out. They called it protection from gangs and that may well be but I can say it is a very confusing mess there. You must be on your toes at all times and anything that might be considered a good time or a good meal for the regular people there would make your hair curl. A dinner with meat for one thing they were so proud of it then. Their McDonalds was such a big deal in Moscow that was the first place they took us before we did our stuff. I will never forget it. The impression was that it may be tough there then but things were looking up but we saw it. That constant worry in the back of our necks and we were INVITED and had plenty of people to make sure things were OK.

I always have to say this because I never want to leave a bad impression of the things I saw there. The people were wonderful. Of course they were supposed to make it all good for us, it was a tit for tat. They were here and then we went there. Still there were a lot of very kind people out and about.

I always say too much when I remember the kind people there. This was my actual response to you about the sleeping and eating and butting out. Like you said the deal then is made that as long as you have a place to sleep and food to eat, butt out of politics. Scary.

Before the economy changed for the better it was the most terrifying visit I have made anywhere.

People were severely malnourished, looked gray and wore somber old clothing.
They never made eye contact and everyone seemed to look at the ground when they walked,
heads bent scurrying around. No loitering allowed.

Nasty, mean red hat police everywhere, ordering people around, dragging them away.
Tourists were given leeway but my camera was confiscated and once I made the mistake of sitting on a low stone wall to rest for a moment after a long walk, and the police grabbed me and made me get off. There were no seats or benches any where. People were not allowed to congregate.

I saw Chinese men being dragged away with terrified looks on their faces.

And yes we had Chinese minders at all time, and only saw what we were allowed to see.
We were told point blank that all calls and emails had to be made through the hotel and were monitored.

After the economic miracle, things changed on the surface. People had decent clothing, were well fed, looked happy. The police were still there but undercover lurking about. When touring various sights, our guides told us certain topics were forbidden and if we said anything out of line in front of the plain clothes police she would be fired or worse.

I love the Chinese people and the country and sights are amazing. But the people only know what they are told. They have little or no idea about international events or other points of view. They get this blank confused look on their faces when I would try to engage in discussions of the US or world events.

One the one hand I love China. The people, the food, the sights, the history are totally amazing. On the other hand the government, repression, the iron clad grip on the people, the autocracy and corruption are terrifying. When you leave on the airplane from China, often the Americans onboard give a cheer and start clapping when lift off is accomplished. They are that glad to leave China.

If not for that occasion I would never have had that feeling, that experience of being watched and tracked. Watching people change their faces so quickly when they see what is coming. You see their face and have to guess what could be that bad on a regular day. Yours sounded much worse than my little occasions but the care for their people seems like it was much the same. AND it was all "hidden" from others. One case is they never blocked off a torn up road and we all almost walked into a 10 foot drop in the sidewalk. No signs or regard for the people. Circuses on the streets with free ranging wild animals inside a flimsy tent. I worked at a zoo for a while and I had NEVER been close to a bear or a lion etc. like that without a weapon or after a tranq. Little kids sitting right there. We left pretty quickly because I knew what one of those animals having a bad day could do to my kids in about 15 seconds.

It is hard to explain how that feels. If I remember correctly, and it never crossed my mind until I read this, I do believe there was clapping when we left as well. Most of the plane was made up of NOT Russians, Germans and Americans I think.

Moscow sounds more like China after the economy changed significantly after 2000 or so.
Repression and danger still there, but with a civilized veneer.

We could feel it for sure. And as foreigners we were given special treatment and it was still scary as hell. In the airport in Guangzhou prior to departure out of the country I had some sort of paperwork snafu (which was resolved quickly), but in the middle of it I saw a group of red hat police approaching me and my life passed before my eyes and I started to cry. I thought for sure I was done for. After two weeks in China, I knew the drill. It turned out to be a minor problem in the end. But if taking pictures of the hotel and sitting on a stone got me in trouble with the red hats, I didn't know what they would do next.

Oh yes the same thing in China. Obviously potentially dangerous roads, sidewalks, animals and no one cares. There are no liability attorneys, and the government does not care or the repair money is stolen by corrupt officials. One thing I saw in China one time was hundreds of pills all thrown into the street. I pointed out to the guide that this was dangerous, children could eat them.
The guide looked puzzled as in no one cares about this issue.

Also there were no birds in China the first time I was there. The pollution was horrific and had killed all the birds. After the economic miracle, the sunlight and birds came back.

It is so sad. China is a wonderful country, the food, the sights, the people. I loved it.
But it scared the hell out of me too.

My sis visited South Korea, Japan, and China on a cruise with friends.
This was relatively recent, so after the economic improvent. And, yeah, she had a minder. Scary!

This is not a challenge I am truly curious about that. I cannot remember the dates of anything since I had some medical problems but we were there after 1990 probably early to mid 90's.

We were on a thank you visit with our children who sang for them. We had hosted the Treasures of the Czars for a nice long visit so what we saw was mostly very protected and regimented and based on good will.

We did get away a few times to wander on our own but not very far and never in Moscow except at Gump where we shopped but had a timer about it. They kept us mostly close so what we were able to do, it was pretty much the pretty stuff....ballet, dancing, dinners and some kick ass vodka in by dark or driven and hosted, no wandering after dark. St Petersburg was a lot less strict during the day and there was not much dark at all when we were there.

These are just my memories and impressions. I loved it, it was for the kids at our school but I had 2 grade school kids of my own and some responsibility to keep them all accounted for as a parent. My impressions were certainly colored by that but these are my memories.

a Russian tour group. The guides spoke perfect English and discussed the hopes of the Russian people to ease tensions with the West. We had the guide with us at some sites and during a night tour of Moscow's beautiful subway stations and lit monuments. The rest of the time we were driven somewhere and turned loose. I walked, by myself, to several places and ate in different restaurants alone. I got lost and asked a Russian policeman for assistance. He knew little English, but got a map up on his phone for me and then translated the street names to English with an app.
Only guards I saw was at Lenin's tomb and Putin's visit in St. Petersburg. Could have been anywhere when a dignitary visits, with blocked off streets and police presence.
I thought Russia was much more modern than what I had been led to believe. The grocery stores we stopped at for breaks and to get snacks were well stocked and prices were lower than in America.

Of course, this was all before Putin bared his teeth and decided to go another direction.

what ideas have you come up with so far, to get me started?

Next step is to give the script to a friend to beta read so I can try to sell my dystopian fantasy series to a studio.

. . .

That is what we're doing now, right?

bad old days of J Edgar Hoover some folks wished it was a fantasy instead of their reality. The point of my article is that it could be much easier today given technology and our current society for repression to be enacted on a wide scale in a far quicker manner than in the past.

For example the only way we have a place to live is if people don't take it away from us. The only way we have food, for the most part, is if our cards work or institutions beyond our control give us access to our cash. Thought of another way, as far as access to cash, you might have a paycheck but if nobody will cash it all you have is a piece of paper.

The imposition of extreme repression of groups and individuals doesn't have to be accomplished with physical force or grabbing people to lock them up.

10 years ago the actual history of the last 8 would seem like dystopian fantasy, and here we are.

experiment right? As I replied in one comment we need to realize how easy it is now to create repression on a large scale, quickly and without violence. Your cards can become worthless to you in seconds as well as being kept from your cash. The only people who doubt about the government making lists and using them against people are the ones too young to have lived through it the last time.

make people think and realize how easily and quickly repression can be done today. See some of my other comments on the reason for the post. 8 years ago you would have said what has gone on the last 8 years as being impossible too.

With respect to the internet, a subscription to a VPN service could mitigate loss of access to some sites (BBC, world news outlets). For personal comms, consider installing Signal (https://signal.org/) which is a free encrypted messaging and telecommunications app.

For the rest, if/when it gets that far, we will need physical allies to enable survival and resistance, complete with all the baggage and complications that entails. To do that effectively, we need knowledge beyond speculation, so it's still too early to ask "now what?"

you take my OP too literally as though it is prediction. It is not as I've said in other comments the purpose is to have people stop and think about how easily and quickly repression can be done in today's world. The "now what" is a like a pause for people to stop and think instead of just going through and waiting for things to hit them.

As an example I'm pretty sure nobody alive today ever saw anything like the Covid period and lockdowns. But people working in those areas were discussing "now what" long before it came to pass. It's like seeing people who are frantic because the ATM's around them are all down and they have only $2.00 in their pocket. Somebody should have impressed upon them "now what" so they weren't so foolish as to walk around with almost no cash. That's just small examples. I also put up the post because we as people not going along need to actually think about countermeasures and coping with increased repression.

So yes rather than just getting on web sites and making comments about how upset we are we had also better realize that many of us here remember the Red Scare days and the government reaction/repression measures in the '50's through the '70's. We didn't expect it to get real bad then either but it did.

I agree with your statement about needing outside assistance and I've posted about that also. I have a very bad feeling that the vast majority of people on our side are going to not consider things and their responses until the wolves are right at their door. So the thought exercise I put up has made people think a little. Good. It served the purpose I intended. The time for "now what" thinking is in fact now and not when the crap is fully engaging the fan.

But those of us on only SS, Medicare, and Medicaid have little resource!
And what might happen with those- I have to deflect serious "what if" scenarios at least till after J20 '25.

for clearly understanding what I was doing in my OP. One thing to another and another. That's why I kept putting in "Now what?" because we need to plan now as you rightly point out rather than try and just react when further repression happens. I remember when they did the first Muslim travel ban and so many wished they had thought ahead.

remember to thank those trying to make it not happen
if you don't find yourself in a camp or worse

regular Coffee Shop with a new, a bit surly counter person runs her active credit card is suddenly declined!

Then that day, or the next all the women employees of her company (and all around the USA) are let go.

So, yeah, THT has visualized some types of repression in general, and of course those unique to women.



(oh, yeah, I cried after he won, and a bit off & on since then. I'm anxious on occasion but fighting off dwelling on it till J20. I'll probably cry a lot on J20, and then be more nervous.)