General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsShould Biden have refused to cede the Whitehouse to Trump? (Poll)
Should have put the brakes on before we went over the cliff, ya think?
| 57 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited | |
| Yes | |
9 (16%) |
|
| No | |
48 (84%) |
|
| 0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided. | |
| Show usernames
Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll |
|
Joinfortmill
(19,907 posts)orangecrush
(28,080 posts)On any number of grounds.
34 felony convictions, for example.
Inciting an insurrection.
Let it make it's way through the courts.
Apparently they have no such concern for such niceties as established norms, and now we're all gonna pay for it.
tritsofme
(19,766 posts)None of those are grounds that he could have pretended that his term didnt end.
What makes you think he could have even pulled his off? His term would have been over, his orders meaningless.
Trump is the only one who would have been amused by seeing federal agents drag Biden out of the White House.
What a terrible idea
LudwigPastorius
(14,047 posts)The Constitution states quite clearly:
After noon, on the 20th, he was no longer the President, just a citizen in the White House, and he would have been escorted out.
confoosed
(62 posts)orangecrush
(28,080 posts)And from now on we are going to go lower than their level if that's what it takes.
If not, we are going to be driven before them.
kelly1mm
(5,756 posts)orangecrush
(28,080 posts)There's something in there about insurrection.
If such a thing is possible dont you think Trump would have done it 4 years ago?
Biden could have invoked something - anything - to stop this farce. If nothing else, he could have cited his newfound powers from the Supreme Court to demand a pause. Biden knew damn well that the election was stolen, as did most sentient human beings. But amazingly nobody lifted a finger in protest. Kamala should not have certified the results and should have demanded a pause while recounts were conducted and an investigation was made. I will never understand why this did not happen. Now we have two insane psychopaths tearing the country apart. And we knew exactly what they were planning on doing before the election (Project 2025 - the blueprint for destruction of our democracy)!
Im sorry that this post is critical of Democrats, but a bit of introspection is warranted at this point. Biden did many great things, but IMHO he failed us on this.
orangecrush
(28,080 posts)But I feel it was a mistake not going everything possible to block him.
EdmondDantes_
(1,311 posts)that would allow that. It says the President can't be charged for official acts. There's nothing that would qualify as official about becoming a dictator or refusing to leave office. Then there's that said protection wouldn't extend to whoever you think was going to enforce his ascension to dictatorship. You may have noticed that a number of things Trump has tried to do have already been put on hold by the courts. You would think that this would put an end to the claim that the president has unlimited power given Trump would absolutely love unlimited power.
DET
(2,349 posts)Except Trump. Nor did I say that the Supreme Court gave unlimited power to the President. The definition of official acts is ambiguous. Somehow I suspect that the SC would take a more liberal view of acts committed by Trump under this ridiculous ruling. Refusing to certify a clearly stolen election is not unreasonable. Especially when dealing with someone who you know is planning to destroy the entire world order (Musk via Trump).
Musk is rigging other countries elections as well as ours, and theyre addressing the issue forcefully but peacefully. It may have been possible to work with NATO or some other international governing body to pause elections until Musk was contained. I really dont know. I just know that we needed some outside the box thinking before our country was handed over to a madman.
tritsofme
(19,766 posts)No matter what, the term was over.
You are suggesting he ought to have just declared himself dictator.
You might as well own that.
DET
(2,349 posts)You can say that a million times (and Im sure that you will), but that does mean that its true. Hell, even if it was true, Id sure prefer Dictator Biden to Dictator Trump. Wouldnt you? Trump was even kind enough to tell us he planned to become a dictator before the election.
tritsofme
(19,766 posts)Im not sure you fool anyone but yourself.
Our failure to defeat Trump in the election was catastrophic, but it doesnt mean I would support making Biden or anyone our dictator.
Crunchy Frog
(28,208 posts)DET
(2,349 posts)Trump said before the election that he would appoint Musk to head up DOGE, which was supposed to find efficiencies in the government. That should have sent up red flags given Musks history of mismanagement and lying and Trumps history of fraud and grift.
Meowmee
(9,212 posts)We are now in grave danger from so many bad actors. Who is going to protect us now?
orangecrush
(28,080 posts)Could say no.
Polybius
(21,394 posts)The end result would be much worse than the Trump 2.0 that we're seeing now.
DET
(2,349 posts)but were going to have a civil war anyway. And in time, even the MAGATs arent going to put up with this shit. We would have been much better off if we still had the levers of power going in.
Crunchy Frog
(28,208 posts)cadoman
(1,617 posts)It was Harris' candidacy and she decided to concede the next day.
She's still our de-facto leader so I trust her judgement on the matter, though I don't agree with her choice based on the facts as I know them.
ecstatic
(35,003 posts)If the doj had simply upheld and enforced the law after the terrorist attack / coup attempt that occurred on January 6th 2021, we wouldn't be here right now.
Obviously, that's not something we want to hear but we have to be honest about everything that led us to this moment. And the worst part is it's not even clear that trump actually won. If someone tries to overthrow the government once and gets away with it, they're going to try again. And it's very possible that elon helped trump to succeed this time. He should not have even had the opportunity to steal it.
Polybius
(21,394 posts)Is that any better?
mvd
(65,826 posts)And just like Trump would have been forced to leave, Biden would have been too. But Biden staying in sure would be a good first resistance move.
orangecrush
(28,080 posts)Sparkly
(24,819 posts)Two impeachments, on OBVIOUS grounds, failed, thanks to cowardly Republicans in the Senate.
Multiple charges with clear evidence fell through in several states, thanks to partisan courts, right up to the 'Supremes.' By the time the DOJ stepped up, it was too late.
The last 'safeguard' was the intelligence of the populace, to prevent such a criminal enterprise from ruling the country -- and that failed. So here we are.
I am powerless now, but I fear for my daughter and granddaughter.
betsuni
(28,643 posts)Mike Niendorff
(3,633 posts)After J6 and the recovery of stolen national security information at Mar-A-Lago, Trump should have been rotting in a prison cell for the rest of his miserable fascist life -- along with his co-conspirators.
Failure to enforce the law has consequences.
MDN
Tommy Carcetti
(44,383 posts)And unfortunately there are consequences for that.
And well have to figure out a way to fix that, but a solution cant be upending our democratic election process.
Cant throw the baby out with the bath water.
orangecrush
(28,080 posts)But I suggest those who say no bookmark, and see if they still feel that way a year from now.
HAB911
(10,246 posts)orangecrush
(28,080 posts)caveat: unless we stop playing by the rules and it's not looking good at this point
Vinca
(53,220 posts)there were a number of suspicious things surrounding the election, but Democrats opted not to make a fuss. There should have been a few court challenges and questioning of things like those bullet ballots. Since Trump was immediately acknowledged as the winner, Biden had no choice but to go through with a normal transition. I hope the 2026 elections won't be hacked by Musk's satellites - assuming we even have elections - but I won't be surprised if every Republican "wins."
PennRalphie
(448 posts)So, no. He followed the constitution and laws of the land.
Yes, we should have known what trump was going to do. He told us. But the Gen Z strategists and senior Democratic politicians working on the Harris campaign didnt focus on all of that enough. It was full steam ahead with rallies featuring Beyoncé and Katy Perry. The world needs to understand-when a bad man tells you what hes going to do, believe him.
themaguffin
(4,885 posts)and before someone says "Biden can't fire him." My point is that trump is ignoring all such rules and laws.
Of course not all of it is working, but the damage is done in most cases. The people will be gone.
Mountainguy
(2,145 posts)Trump is a dictator! Biden should have ignored the election and declared himself king!
Biden didn't have and more authority to ignore an election than Trump did.
We lost to a guy that had 34 felonies. We probably need to address WHY that happened and why we are so unpopular that is could.
Self Esteem
(2,248 posts)Remember four years ago when there was talk Trump would do exactly what you're saying Biden should do? Nothing would have kept Biden in office - just like it wouldn't have worked for Trump in 2021. Biden could get on national TV and say, "I'm not leaving and I will declare martial law..." and nothing will happen because his term will end at 11:59am on 1/20. There's nothing that allows for him to extend his term. Legally, the second noon strikes in Washington on 1/20, the new president takes control. That means the military is now under his leadership - not Biden's.
It was the same in 2021 and all that talk about Trump refusing to give up power. The second it struck noon, Trump was no longer president and had he refused to give up power, the Secret Service would have forcibly removed him from the White House.
There's no mechanism that would have allowed for Biden to just declare he's not leaving the White House.
HereForTheParty
(915 posts)That's what is so distressing.
orangecrush
(28,080 posts)tritsofme
(19,766 posts)And the conspiracy theories they hawked werent any better than these ones, or much different at all.
The difference being that our leaders like Harris didnt try to fool their supporters with nonsense and scam them out of millions of dollars fighting nothing
because they lost.
Hope22
(4,420 posts)Should Harris have requested battleground states be recounted on the grounds that T said PA was rigged repeatedly. In light of T telling voters he didnt need their votes.