General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIn 1862, a Union soldier found cigars wrapped in a piece of paper in a field of clover.

https://bsky.app/profile/markjacob.bsky.social/post/3lleqpehttk2i
Key background on this true story:
The "Lost Order":
The document in question was Special Order 191, issued by Confederate General Robert E. Lee. It detailed his plans for the Maryland Campaign in 1862.
The Discovery:
On September 13, 1862, Union Corporal Barton W. Mitchell of the 27th Indiana Volunteer Infantry found a copy of the order in a field near Frederick, Maryland.
The order was wrapped around a few cigars.
The Significance:
This discovery provided Union General George McClellan with crucial intelligence about Lee's troop movements and intentions.
It played a significant role in the lead-up to the Battle of Antietam, one of the bloodiest single-day battles in American history.

ProfessorGAC
(72,081 posts)This has been covered on the History Chanbel show "What History Forgot" or maybe "Ametica:Fact Or Fiction".
It was there that I was reminded about that story I heard when a grade school kid.
Wounded Bear
(61,622 posts)or at least severly crippled the South's Eastern military capability.
malthaussen
(18,048 posts)With all the advantages of considerable numerical strength and advanced knowledge of the precise enemy intentions, he was barely able to achieve a tactical draw. And then allowed the ANV to escape without further damage, tainting even the strategic value of the battle.
OTOH, one could argue that Antietam was the most decisive battle of the Civil War, because it gave Abe the pretext to issue the Emancipation Proclamation and make the war about slavery, and not just preserving the Union.
-- Mal
Wounded Bear
(61,622 posts)for someone like Grant, if he could have set aside his giant ego. MacClellan built the Army of the Potomac, that would eventually win the war in the East.
malthaussen
(18,048 posts)He received too much adulation too young, and it went to his head. And the Army of the Potomac was split into mutually-hostile factions, with some of the senior officers such confirmed McClellan men they would have (did have) acted disloyally to any other general. Grant left Meade in command because he didn't have such a clique behind him (and he was not completely without merit). Hooker was transferred West where he, too, soon let his ego get the better of him.
McClellan deserves credit not only for building the Army of the Potomac, but in restoring its morale after Second Bull Run so that it could even get to Antietam to fight. Of course, the factions I mentioned were a large part of why the AoP had such poor morale after Second Bull Run; and in that campaign especially you see the effects of raging egos and disloyal conduct, and the refusal to cooperate for the good of the Union. Pope may have been an ass and an incompetent, but if he hadn't been torpedoed by officers loyal to McClellan (I'm thinking Franklin more than Porter), he was still in a position to do a bit of no-no to the ANV. The interesting thing to me is that even the troops who had never served under McClellan (about two-thirds of Pope's army) still fell under his spell immediately, and fought like lions at Antietam. Very poorly-directed lions, but lions nevertheless.
-- Mal
MissouriDem47
(138 posts)If Grant had been the commanding general of the Union army on that day they would have destroyed Lee's Army of Northern Virginia.
NNadir
(35,414 posts)As usual he was slow to act and easily frightened.
malthaussen
(18,048 posts)... that he hoped for a peaceful resolution and the return to the status quo ante if he didn't hurt them so badly they'd get angry. Stupid, but on a different level than mere incompetence.
It's also been suggested that he was a bloody coward, even though he demonstrated great bravery in the Mexican War. That was then; he does demonstrate personal timidity as well as command paralysis once the stakes got higher.
-- Mal
NNadir
(35,414 posts)...knew failure and therefore wasn't afraid to risk it, having survived it.
My favorite quote relevant to this point about Grant, although not specific to him, was made by Eleanor Roosevelt:
“You gain strength, courage and confidence by every experience in which you really stop to look fear in the face. You are able to say to yourself, 'I have lived through this horror. I can take the next thing that comes along.' You must do the thing you think you cannot do.”
Like other figures in history, McClellan, was so obsessed with his ego that he refused to challenge it.
3825-87867
(1,331 posts)With the last sentence of the illustration, I can safely say you should have posted that in the Humor Forum!!!
LeftyLucie
(40 posts)"How Few Remain" -- he's a clunky writer but a master at imaging alternative paths for history based on a single twist (not finding the cigars).
It's the first book in the Southern Victory series in which CSA and USA find themselves on opposite sides of WWI and WWII.
3auld6phart
(1,495 posts)The verbiage he came out to cover the stupidity of his Shi show.are they all idiots? … yes!
calimary
(85,595 posts)I’m sorry, but that made me laugh!
He deserves to be a laughingstock, nationwide.
John1956PA
(3,874 posts)Ping Tung
(1,946 posts)Lincoln made the war about slavery rather than state's rights. That ended any hope of help from Europe to recognize them as a country and stop the blockade which was ruining them.
Mysterian
(5,484 posts)The war was very much about slavery from the first shot.
NNadir
(35,414 posts)A favorite Lincoln remark on McClellan to McClellan:
Lincoln and McClellan’s Fatigued Horses
Bernardo de La Paz
(53,673 posts)TNNurse
(7,282 posts)but the comment about Hegseth made me hoot outloud.
Thank you.
NNadir
(35,414 posts)Cirsium
(2,142 posts)Too bad McClellan didn't act aggressively on the intel.
Kali
(56,163 posts)
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(120,788 posts)There are a lot of times battles were lost because the enemy found out their foe's plans. This is why discretion and secrecy are so important.
MayReasonRule
(2,820 posts)Honor is the better part of Justice.
Justice sustains each of our Freedoms.
Freedoms are the substance and sustenance of Life.
Here's to the displacement and dissolution of the American Fascist Party aka the GOP.
Here's to reason's rule.
BidenRocks
(1,242 posts)AllaN01Bear
(24,429 posts)thanks for sharing.
Marcuse
(8,247 posts)
BattleRow
(1,536 posts)Emile
(33,650 posts)Martin Eden
(14,056 posts)He was very good at organizing and training an army, was pitiful when it came to commanding an army in battle. He was slow and overly cautious, taking counsel from his fears and always overestimating the enemy's forces.
At Anteitnam he fed his divisions in piecemeal and never committed his reserve, providing Lee with time for reinforcements to arrive, which enabled the Confederate army to escape across the river.
After McClellan was relieved of his command he ran against Lincoln in the 1864 election, promising to end the war short of Union victory.
PoindexterOglethorpe
(27,591 posts)that has the cigar & invasion plans were not found by the Union Army. It's an interesting take on the ubiquitous "If the south had won the civil war" novels out there.
electric_blue68
(20,513 posts)Hegseth, heh!
orangecrush
(23,908 posts)The plans would have been inside an empty vodka bottle.
malthaussen
(18,048 posts)... the NCOs turned them into their CO with the plans, but who (if anybody) ever smoked them is lost to history.
-- Mal
summer_in_TX
(3,515 posts)I have no idea whether the leak to The Atlantic was an accident or not. But this piece makes a damn fine argument about that and about the leak about Musk being briefed on war plans with China.
https://thewestpointhistoryprofessor.substack.com/p/a-powerful-cell-is-operating-the?r=2vqus&utm_medium=ios&triedRedirect=true
Terrence Goggin writes The West Point History Professor on Substack. The Wikipedia article on Terry Goggin indicates he taught history and other subjects at West Point. He took a tumble later in his career and apparently defrauded some investors, but most of his career looks respectable.
THE BEFUDDLED TRUMP TEAM HAVEN’T READ “ALL THE PRESIDENT’S MEN”. THEY SHOULD DO SO NOW.
The new “President’s Men” have been deeply penetrated. The Trump team has been exposed as profoundly; stupidly; arrogant. And that goes for everyone involved on their side of the table. Politics is like Showbiz, you can’t fake talent or basic competence. And you cannot hide a lack of brains.
snip…
What’s interesting is that both leaks involved Operating Plans, the most sensitive and highly prized information that exists. Both leaks involved the disclosure of the existence of a meeting to discus those plans to two different media. The New York Times, owned and controlled by the Ochs-Sulzberger family, notoriously rich and independent and the Atlantic Magazine, owned by Laurene Powell Jobs, a billionaire many times over. Neither can be intimidated by Trumps threats, as could Jeff Bezos, owner of the Washington Post, or the Television Networks with federal licenses that could be suspended or cancelled . The two leaks were thought through at a granular level.
snip…
snip…
As for The Atlantic's Jeffrey Goldberg,
Looks like Hegseth's arrogance and firing of respected leaders without cause is not popular. Same with Musk.
It's plausible enough to give me some hope.
Meowmee
(8,121 posts)

VGNonly
(7,997 posts)McClellan squandered his advantage.
I've been to Antietam twice. The Cornfield, Dunker Church, Bloody Lane and Burnside Bridge. Interesting topography.
UpInArms
(52,415 posts)“Loose lips sink ships”
Sneederbunk
(15,991 posts)Turned back Lee's invasion of the North. Ended hopes for foreign recognition of the Confederacy. Allowed Lincoln to issue Emancipation Proclamation.
BoRaGard
(4,657 posts)Asking for the GOP.