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surfered

(11,556 posts)
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 12:12 PM Jul 2025

Growing up in Austin, TX, I had experience with Hill Country flash floods

Geologically known as the Edwards Plateau, it was once covered by seawater. There is subsurface limestone as well as outcroppings, caliche soil littered with marine fossils. Rain water doesn’t soak in, running down hill, thru old creek beds that only have water in them after rains.

In addition to hiking and camping, my Boy Scout Troop got into canoeing. We took summer canoe trips down the Colorado and Guadalupe Rivers.

The Guadalupe area is popular for tubing, camping, and venues for retreats. On one canoe trip down the Guadalupe in the early 60’s, we were awakened in the middle of the night by rising water, caused by a thunderstorm near Comfort, TX.

We gathered up our gear and drug our canoes uphill to higher ground. My father, our Scoutmaster, hiked to a farmhouse, and used their phone to call parents for help.

When we returned the next day to retrieve my father’s station wagon parked upstream, we found it had been inundated by the high water. Luckily, it was the only casualty.

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Growing up in Austin, TX, I had experience with Hill Country flash floods (Original Post) surfered Jul 2025 OP
More common than people might think! Glad you got out! marble falls Jul 2025 #1
They had a flooding tragedy at a camp in Comfort in 1987. Ten teens died. tanyev Jul 2025 #2
Did they not receive any warnimg of flooding? SheltieLover Jul 2025 #3
They did, 4 am. NOAA. Igel Jul 2025 #8
Omg how awful! SheltieLover Jul 2025 #12
1:14AM NWS EMERGENCY WARNING. WarGamer Jul 2025 #15
I wonder if they send warnings out to cellphones? Swede Jul 2025 #17
Add the increasing impact of climate change bronxiteforever Jul 2025 #4
I grew up on the High Plains. markodochartaigh Jul 2025 #5
Had a house out on Greg_In_SF Jul 2025 #6
I remember going to summer BSA camp outside San Marcos LetMyPeopleVote Jul 2025 #7
The Guadalupe is a beautiful river - pristine, crystal-clear water dalton99a Jul 2025 #9
I saw on a Facebook weather page electricmonk Jul 2025 #10
This may be a funding issue pinkstarburst Jul 2025 #11
Why would anyone send their kids to camp in such a region? SheltieLover Jul 2025 #13
Do you mean Texas or the South in general? If so, I agree with you. erronis Jul 2025 #14
Well yes to both, but that specific flood prone area. SheltieLover Jul 2025 #18
Why would overnight camps be legal there? colorado_ufo Jul 2025 #16
Good question! SheltieLover Jul 2025 #19

tanyev

(48,669 posts)
2. They had a flooding tragedy at a camp in Comfort in 1987. Ten teens died.
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 12:22 PM
Jul 2025

I'm surprised the camps and local officials didn't implement stricter measures after that--no sleeping cabins allowed near the river, require participation in the best early warning technology available, etc.

This is tragic, and unnecessarily so.

SheltieLover

(76,859 posts)
3. Did they not receive any warnimg of flooding?
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 12:24 PM
Jul 2025

Maybe kremlin is bonusing slob for dead Americans.

Igel

(37,369 posts)
8. They did, 4 am. NOAA.
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 01:13 PM
Jul 2025

By then the water was already rising and the news said it rose up to 25' in 25 minutes.

Swede

(38,364 posts)
17. I wonder if they send warnings out to cellphones?
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 03:54 PM
Jul 2025

That way more people would be in the know.

bronxiteforever

(11,100 posts)
4. Add the increasing impact of climate change
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 12:36 PM
Jul 2025

Flash floods happened before climate change kicked into gear but as the EPA wrote (before the Dark Ages)

Texas’s climate is changing. Most of the state has warmed between one-half and one degree (F) in the past century. In the eastern two-thirds of the state, average annual rainfall is increasing, yet the soil
is becoming drier. Rainstorms are becoming more intense, and floods are becoming more severe. Along much of the coast, the sea is rising almost two inches per decade. In the coming decades, storms are likely to become more severe, deserts may expand, and summers are likely to become increasingly hot and dry, creating problems for agriculture and possibly human health.

https://www.epa.gov/sites/default/files/2016-09/documents/climate-change-tx.pdf


markodochartaigh

(5,036 posts)
5. I grew up on the High Plains.
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 12:39 PM
Jul 2025

Thousands of square miles of very flat land with heavy clay soil that absorbs water very slowly, meaning most water runs off. There are a few canyons which people hike. In school they told us that if you see storm clouds on the horizon it may be fifty miles away but get out of the canyon immediately. The runoff from all of that flat land can fill the hundred foot deep canyon before you can climb to the top. If you wait until the dry creek has a few inches of water in it you have already waited too long.

LetMyPeopleVote

(175,007 posts)
7. I remember going to summer BSA camp outside San Marcos
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 12:55 PM
Jul 2025

As a scout leader, I was great with winter camp where I ended getting the iceberg award 5 or 6 times, but summer camp was hard on me. I had a SUV and I had to tow the scout trailer for most trips to summer or winter camp a couple of times. Luckily, we had some leaders who could back up the trailer after I got it to camp. The hill country will flood with even a small amount of rain. I remember hiking up the hill to go for meals.

One of my middle child's classmates used to go to Camp Mystic every summer. I am glad that this classmate's children are too young to go to camp this year. My middle child and her classmate are very upset about the news about Camp Mystic

electricmonk

(2,015 posts)
10. I saw on a Facebook weather page
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 01:48 PM
Jul 2025

a clip of an article about the flood. Judge Kelly said about the river that it's the most dangerous river in the country for flash flooding. The discussion was about if that's a known fact that it floods often and is a popular summer destination why is there no early warning system for floods along it. That's separate from the NWS flood warnings, one that warns about the river levels in real time and sets off sirens. I know I've camped in lots of places that have signs up saying, "If alarm sounds move to higher ground immediately."

pinkstarburst

(1,875 posts)
11. This may be a funding issue
Sat Jul 5, 2025, 02:05 PM
Jul 2025

This is a very rural area.

I am in Austin, and we do not have tornado sirens, for example. Nor do we have flood sirens along our major waterways that have flash floods like this. You watch the news when the weather is getting bad, and you have the warning that goes off on your phone, which will hopefully alert you even in the middle of the night. My phone has been going off all day with flood warnings. I am still wondering why that phone alert didn't seem to get to the camp directors, and local law enforcement, who surely would have had cell phones. Some of our local meteorologists are saying on social media that NWS posted flood warnings for the area at 1 AM. Perhaps the cell phone reception is so bad in the area (again because it is so rural) that they just didn't get the alerts over their phones? If so, that is truly tragic.

But back to sirens.

When we had a series of tornados come through Austin several years back, the question of why we don't have tornado sirens came up, and it was explained that not only would it be extremely expensive to implement a siren system across the entire city, but it would have to be constantly maintained, tested every few weeks (annoying!) and upgraded and that was difficult (and expensive) to do as well. In short, it was safer to rely on the cell phone warning system that is currently in place. But that may not be the case everywhere. We'll have to see what comes of this as they investigate and try to prevent future tragedies like this.

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