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Takket

(23,478 posts)
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 11:27 AM Dec 22

oh COME ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Burgum: "Today we're sending notifications to the 5 large offshore wind projects that are under construction that their leases will be suspended due to national security concerns ... the Dept of War has come back conclusively that these large offshore wind programs create radar interference"

Aaron Rupar (@atrupar.com) 2025-12-22T13:58:18.552Z


FFS.............. we have an entire government now literally just making shit up...........
80 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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oh COME ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Original Post) Takket Dec 22 OP
Wind farms are known to interfere with Trump's hair in the White House dalton99a Dec 22 #1
Good one MustLoveBeagles Dec 22 #2
Hell...the damn things had to be responsible for Limbaugh dying Bengus81 Dec 22 #37
Have they been known canetoad Dec 22 #47
Bingo. Permanut Dec 22 #52
Is that why it always looked windswept? BattleRow Dec 23 #79
Making shit up RussBLib Dec 22 #3
Ain't that the truth gilligan Dec 22 #49
Ruination of the economy BOSSHOG Dec 22 #4
Well, Ear Cancer has just been cured. surfered Dec 22 #5
Next, the thugs will attack land-based wind farms and solar arrays, all in a nod to the fossil fuel industry. John1956PA Dec 22 #6
+1. They're jacking up electric bills dalton99a Dec 22 #7
In blue states. Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Virginia, Connecticut, New York. mahina Dec 22 #43
They better not touch Palm springs most of the electricity is generated by wind farms kimbutgar Dec 22 #19
It's a beautiful thing too. Hello from the Twin Palms neighborhood! OMGWTF Dec 22 #27
I love Palm Springs whenever we drive from the SF Bay Area to Arizona to visit my mother in law we stay overnight kimbutgar Dec 22 #36
If you get to take the tram up the mountain, be careful at the bar Attilatheblond Dec 22 #53
I'll have my son with me so I won't be drinking ! kimbutgar Dec 22 #77
Do NOT miss that tram ride. ChazInAz Dec 23 #80
That billion dollar "contribution" Trump demanded from the extractive energy interests requires a lot of quid pro quo. sop Dec 22 #33
Yeah, i don't know why the Orange Hellbeast would leave the land based wind farms alone. ShazzieB Dec 22 #64
A 60 turbine farm was just nixed here. progressoid Dec 22 #69
Thank you for posting. To me, a sixty-turbin wind facility would seem mammoth. John1956PA Dec 22 #70
Actually- it's small womanofthehills Dec 22 #73
These aren't as tall as the off-shore turbines progressoid Dec 22 #78
The Crackpot-in-Chief has a phobia. He's afraid of wind-generated energy. All the sheeple in MAGA are bleating and Martin68 Dec 22 #8
Could it be the fossil fuel industry doesn't want wind-generated energy? KS Toronado Dec 22 #11
Paying him under the table? Nope. WestMichRad Dec 22 #26
He is afraid of the oil executives closing their wallets to him. Bev54 Dec 22 #41
Bet they have no proof from scientists to back up their claim! KS Toronado Dec 22 #9
Scientists lol? I bet they dont even have good data from their own navy radar operators. Volaris Dec 22 #22
They don't believe in science. RFK jr will make any statement they need. Bev54 Dec 22 #42
Psychopaths live for chaos and the creation of chaos. littlemissmartypants Dec 22 #10
But ... let me guess ... offshore oil platforms don't cause interference? Zelda_Orchid Dec 22 #12
Correct. And neither do the myriad of Disaffected Dec 22 #14
Exactly!!!!! odins folly Dec 22 #48
As a former military radar operator odins folly Dec 22 #13
Did you work ... dumbcat Dec 22 #40
Ai also makes stuff up regularly. mahina Dec 22 #44
At that time it was a conventional radar odins folly Dec 22 #51
Could it be the movement of the blades Disaffected Dec 22 #55
If that were the case odins folly Dec 22 #56
I don't understand either of those claims. Disaffected Dec 22 #60
What I was saying odins folly Dec 22 #63
A little more detail ..... dumbcat Dec 22 #65
Something missing is the operator odins folly Dec 22 #72
ALLUVA, sudden???? CTyankee Dec 22 #15
The stupid... GiqueCee Dec 22 #16
Complete malarkey nt evemac Dec 22 #17
I wish him gone Figarosmom Dec 22 #18
Orsted, the company doing the northeast offshore wind project, is headquartered in... debsy Dec 22 #20
He's definitely going to declare war on Denmark.... littlemissmartypants Dec 22 #28
That pretty much clinches it IMO. Disaffected Dec 22 #61
I read that is one of 5 companies womanofthehills Dec 22 #74
Terrorist wind-mills right on our shore EEEk! Ping Tung Dec 22 #21
Can we please get rid of the screaming toddlers and put the adults back in charge? Initech Dec 22 #23
"It's a criminal enterprise." Malcolm Nance littlemissmartypants Dec 22 #29
Don "Quixote" Trump LudwigPastorius Dec 22 #24
OK liberalgunwilltravel Dec 22 #25
Meanwhile, in the rest of the world bagimin Dec 22 #30
Bullshit. gay texan Dec 22 #31
There's something about that Burgum fella Seinan Sensei Dec 22 #32
So let's see the evidence! rurallib Dec 22 #34
So now radar can't work with air moving? Bengus81 Dec 22 #35
Big Oil Cherokee100 Dec 22 #38
EPSTEIN FILES EPSTEIN FILES EPSTEIN FILES Bengus81 Dec 22 #39
This country is a laughingstock orangecrush Dec 22 #45
I would imagine large tacky ballrooms also create radar interference ToxMarz Dec 22 #46
That fat pig canceled leases by fiat because he don't like windmills? Warpy Dec 22 #50
When this administration crashes... MiHale Dec 22 #54
This is a type of "taking" IbogaProject Dec 22 #57
Did the Department of War come to this conclusion when it was half in the bag or all in the bag? Vinca Dec 22 #58
All oil rigs Rcanouse Dec 22 #59
trmp is in the Venezuela Oil Business...want's No Competition. spanone Dec 22 #62
And of course it was all Biden's fault!!!!!!! MorbidButterflyTat Dec 22 #66
Not surprising Samael13 Dec 22 #67
Trump hates windmills and wants them Gone! YoshidaYui Dec 22 #68
"... unwinds damage done by Biden's green agenda"??? calimary Dec 22 #71
They "interfere" with radar Progressive dog Dec 22 #75
Hope our power grid isnt being taxed by new technology Johonny Dec 22 #76

RussBLib

(10,423 posts)
3. Making shit up
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 11:40 AM
Dec 22

...and fucking shit up. What a cast of misfits, grifters, and know-nothings, not to mention foreign agents mangling as much of America as possible.

Merry Christmas seems rather out of place these days. Hard to be "Merry" when this nation is being torn apart.

https://russblib.blogspot.com/?m=1

BOSSHOG

(44,738 posts)
4. Ruination of the economy
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 11:42 AM
Dec 22

By people who voted for republicans. Trump should be in jail. John roberts has no integrity. People who voted for trump will not take responsibility for their actions. Trump is free and John roberts could not possibly care less.

John1956PA

(4,817 posts)
6. Next, the thugs will attack land-based wind farms and solar arrays, all in a nod to the fossil fuel industry.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 11:56 AM
Dec 22

kimbutgar

(26,800 posts)
36. I love Palm Springs whenever we drive from the SF Bay Area to Arizona to visit my mother in law we stay overnight
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:59 PM
Dec 22

In Palm Springs. We’re going to Arizona again at the end of January and plan to spend two nights there and really enjoy the area more. And hope to take the tram!

Attilatheblond

(8,291 posts)
53. If you get to take the tram up the mountain, be careful at the bar
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:14 PM
Dec 22

My brother & his best friend, both only occasional beer drinkers, hiked around a bit, then each had a beer. Got seriously looped in record time at that altitude.

ChazInAz

(2,993 posts)
80. Do NOT miss that tram ride.
Tue Dec 23, 2025, 11:17 AM
Dec 23

Years ago, my late wife and I took it, and had supper at the restaurant up top. It was dark when we descended, and as we crossed the almost empty, off-season parking lot to my Miata the local mob of raccoons spied us. Patty was terrified as the horde surrounded us, followed us to our vehicle, chittering and purring. I got to play heroic defender as I opened her door, only to have one of the brigands hop in after her...and onto her lap. Naturally, I scooped the beast up, gave it a good petting and offered it back to her to see if she'd like to pet it.
For some reason, she declined.

sop

(17,426 posts)
33. That billion dollar "contribution" Trump demanded from the extractive energy interests requires a lot of quid pro quo.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:57 PM
Dec 22

ShazzieB

(22,214 posts)
64. Yeah, i don't know why the Orange Hellbeast would leave the land based wind farms alone.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 04:29 PM
Dec 22

It might be a little harder to gin up an excuse to go after those, but I'm sure his goons will find a way.

progressoid

(52,582 posts)
69. A 60 turbine farm was just nixed here.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 07:02 PM
Dec 22

They don't say why, but it is implied that the knuckle-draggers convinced MidAmerican to shut it down.

https://www.radioiowa.com/2025/12/18/midamerican-scraps-plan-for-northwest-iowa-wind-farm/

MidAmerican’s proposed Siouxland Wind Farm would have had about 60 wind turbines. At times, crowds of over 100 people had attended Woodbury County supervisors meetings to express their opposition to the project. “Thank you to all our citizens for their support and just their feedback regarding that project over the years,” Bittinger said. “That’s just a good win for the county.”

Woodbury County Supervisor Mark Nelson said the intense public debate about the project turned out to be a positive. “Although they were trying to stop something, it was very uniting and I heard from a lot of people that they didn’t know that their neighbors or the guy down the road or that this person over here cared so much about the future of the county,” Nelson said. “And it has made a lot of friendships of people that have otherwise would have never met, or had a conversation about the future of Woodbury County.”

MidAmerican unveiled plans for the wind farm in late 2021 and began acquiring easements in early 2022. Some landowners have already received annual payments for those easements and a MidAmerican spokesman says they’ll be able to keep that money. MidAmerican owns and operates more wind energy than any other investor-owned utility in the nation. The company says it considers a number of factors when deciding whether the continue projects, including acceptance from the community and increases in costs.

womanofthehills

(10,713 posts)
73. Actually- it's small
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 08:31 PM
Dec 22

Sun-Zia wind farm in NM which should be completed in 2026 has over 900 wind turbines. When finished, it will be the largest wind farm in US with 3.5 GW.

Unfortunately- I have some Western Spirit Wind Farm 90 ft tall wind transmission lines on the lower end of my property. That wind farm has 377 turbines.

progressoid

(52,582 posts)
78. These aren't as tall as the off-shore turbines
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 11:34 PM
Dec 22

But they are still impressive. I did a little work on a 265 turbine "farm" about a decade ago.

Iowa has over 6000 turbines which produces about two thirds of our electricity.

I knew someone in a rural IA town whose municipal electricity was owned by the citizens of the town (SOCIALISM!) . The wind turbines around them produce more electricity than can use so they sell the excess to the grid. Their elec bills are very low. When people's gas furnaces need to be replaced, they use electric ones.

Martin68

(27,061 posts)
8. The Crackpot-in-Chief has a phobia. He's afraid of wind-generated energy. All the sheeple in MAGA are bleating and
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:05 PM
Dec 22

going along with every insane policy Dump enforces.

KS Toronado

(23,060 posts)
11. Could it be the fossil fuel industry doesn't want wind-generated energy?
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:12 PM
Dec 22

And dumpie goes along because they're paying him under the table?

WestMichRad

(2,930 posts)
26. Paying him under the table? Nope.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:46 PM
Dec 22

Fossil fuel execs openly bought him with a $1 billion campaign “donation” in ‘24.

Volaris

(11,401 posts)
22. Scientists lol? I bet they dont even have good data from their own navy radar operators.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:42 PM
Dec 22

littlemissmartypants

(31,640 posts)
10. Psychopaths live for chaos and the creation of chaos.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:11 PM
Dec 22

No one should be surprised by their shenanigans at this point.

"It’s a criminal enterprise."
~Malcolm Nance


Characteristics of Psychopaths

1. Aggressive, callous, and cunning
2. Complete absence of conscience and empathy
3. Very adept at manipulating others
4. Willingness to engage in immoral, criminal conduct
5. Willingness to take what they want and do as they please, regardless of who is hurt or wronged
6. Deceptive ability to appear outwardly benevolent
7. Deceptive ability to behave in superficially charming ways to hide purely selfish motives
8. Willingness to use intimidation and violence to control others in order to satisfy their own needs
9. Willingness to intentionally violate the basic inherent human rights of others
10. Complete absence of any sense of guilt or remorse for the harm their actions have caused to others
11. Rationalization of their own immoral behavior
12. Will attempt to lay blame upon someone else for their own conduct
13. Denial, will deny their own wrongdoing outright
14. Utter contemptuousness toward the feelings and desires of their fellow beings
15. Pathological lying, will say anything without any concern for truth to advance their own hidden agendas
16. Ablity to feign [fake] normal human emotions and empathy
17. Distorted sense of the consequences of their actions
18. Total failure to accept any responsibility for their own socially irresponsible ways
19. Strong bellef that they will never be brought to justice for their criminal behavior

Disaffected

(6,161 posts)
14. Correct. And neither do the myriad of
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:18 PM
Dec 22

large commercial vessels (whose numbers far outweigh off-shore windturbs).

odins folly

(547 posts)
13. As a former military radar operator
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:16 PM
Dec 22

I can unequivocally say they are full of shit.

I was at a radar station on the NC coast. We did not have any interference with anything at or slightly above ground level once you got about half a mile out.

dumbcat

(2,158 posts)
40. Did you work ...
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 01:12 PM
Dec 22

conventional radar, or OTH ABM system radars? Big difference.

Decades ago I used to evaluate the efficacy and effectiveness of Over the Horizon radars. They could definitely be affected by wind turbines.

Currently, AI sez:

Can off shore wind turbines affect over the horizon radars?

Yes — offshore wind turbines can affect over-the-horizon (OTH) radars, and this is a well-recognized technical and national-security issue. The effects depend on the radar type, operating frequency, turbine layout, and distance.

odins folly

(547 posts)
51. At that time it was a conventional radar
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:05 PM
Dec 22

Actually 2: one search the other was a height finder. If I remember correctly the OTH that the USAF played with in the 80’s and early 90’s was ionosphere bouncing vs. ground propagation.
As for ABM, those radars look straight out from the fan to detect an incoming missile as it crests the horizon. I worked ABM in Thule.

Also, when an object does not move, and the item you are looking for is moving, it becomes easy to detect. If our NATSEC radars are not affected by oil platforms they wouldn’t be affected by wind towers.

Disaffected

(6,161 posts)
55. Could it be the movement of the blades
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:37 PM
Dec 22

that causes an issue? OTOH, the blades are typically composed of fibreglass which might not reflect radar waves(?).

It sounds like BS but it is not inconceivable IMO that some types of radar might be affected.

odins folly

(547 posts)
56. If that were the case
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:44 PM
Dec 22

Then every single prop driven aircraft would be stealth. No the rotation of the blade does not affect radar.

Things to keep in mind, radar waves are frequencies that travel at about the speed of light, I believe it was around 186,000 miles per second. The bases of either an aircraft or was wind power blade travel significantly slower so the waves of the radar go between the blades.

This is an oversimplified explanation.

Disaffected

(6,161 posts)
60. I don't understand either of those claims.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 03:21 PM
Dec 22

"If that were the case, every prop driven aircraft would be stealth"?? I am saying that the movement of the blades may interfere/react with the radar so how does that translate into prop driven aircraft becoming stealthy? Are you saying that movement of the wind turbine blades would, if that were the case, make them "stealthy" (not visible to radar)?

And, "waves of radar go between the blades" because they travel significantly slower than radar?? Well yes, I would think that would be the case for some of the radar but why would that would that preclude some portion of it being reflected by the (moving) blades?

odins folly

(547 posts)
63. What I was saying
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 04:10 PM
Dec 22

Was that the blades do not affect radar waves at all.

But don’t take my word for it. Although the AI stated above says it could, research something besides AI.

Cheers

dumbcat

(2,158 posts)
65. A little more detail .....
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 04:32 PM
Dec 22

.... from ChatGPT. I know a lot of people don't like or trust AI, including me in some areas, but I have found ChatGPT to be pretty accurate in RF and propagation areas.

Why OTH radars are sensitive

Over-the-horizon radars work very differently from conventional radars:
They operate in the high-frequency (HF) band (roughly 3–30 MHz).
They rely on surface-wave propagation along the ocean or ionospheric reflection to see hundreds or thousands of miles beyond line of sight.
They detect very weak Doppler signals from distant aircraft, ships, or missiles.
Because of this, they are unusually sensitive to large conductive objects near the sea surface.

How offshore wind turbines interfere
1. Strong radar clutter
Turbine towers and blades are excellent HF reflectors.
Rotating blades create Doppler shifts that look like moving targets.
Large wind farms can generate persistent “false returns.”

2. Masking of real targets

Clutter from turbines can hide or degrade detection of:
Low-flying aircraft
Cruise missiles
Surface vessels
This is especially serious for early-warning and maritime surveillance radars.

3. Surface-wave disruption

OTH surface-wave radars rely on smooth ocean propagation.
Turbine foundations disturb the electromagnetic boundary conditions along the sea surface.
Dense turbine fields can reduce signal coherence.

4. Multipath and phase distortion

Turbines create unpredictable reflections that:
Distort bearing accuracy
Reduce tracking reliability
Increase false alarms

odins folly

(547 posts)
72. Something missing is the operator
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 08:09 PM
Dec 22

If a radar system doesn’t have a human, then by all means it could cause interference. When I worked with BWMEWS we had to block moon rise because the computer would register it as a large scale missed launch with an endpoint within the CONUS.

Same principle..

The other thing it doesn’t mention is range. OTH systems detect between 500 and 2,000 miles from the array. I looked up the projects that are impacted and the furthest from shore is around 30 miles.

I don’t want to argue about my real life experience and some artificial intelligence answers.

Cheers,

debsy

(760 posts)
20. Orsted, the company doing the northeast offshore wind project, is headquartered in...
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:39 PM
Dec 22

… wait for it…

Denmark (national security risk because Greenland?)

https://orsted.com/]

I know this because I invested in their company in the early 2020’s when we were living in New London, CT. Things were going well under President Joe Biden then. The picture on the front page of the NYT today is looking north, up the Thames river in New London, at the turning Oates that are sitting dormant because of the asshole in chief:

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/12/22/climate/trump-offshore-wind-farms.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share]

I think he is going to declare war on Denmark. These people are so far out of control…

littlemissmartypants

(31,640 posts)
28. He's definitely going to declare war on Denmark....
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:50 PM
Dec 22

Immediately after Gaza is rebuilt and Venezuela has a new government.

Disaffected

(6,161 posts)
61. That pretty much clinches it IMO.
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 03:25 PM
Dec 22

Trump is pissed at Denmark for not handing over Greenland as well as his nutso obsession with wind turbines.

womanofthehills

(10,713 posts)
74. I read that is one of 5 companies
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 08:41 PM
Dec 22

Each have invested many billions. I think the Denmark one is already mostly online supplying over 400,000 families

rurallib

(64,554 posts)
34. So let's see the evidence!
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:58 PM
Dec 22

ETA: what about all the towers in the middle of the country? Don't they cause interference?

Bengus81

(9,826 posts)
35. So now radar can't work with air moving?
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 12:58 PM
Dec 22

Funny,it works just fine in a commercial aircraft doing 450 knots.

Cherokee100

(434 posts)
38. Big Oil
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 01:01 PM
Dec 22

I bet Big Oil, is laughing all the way, to the bank. As former a radar operator/'tech' in the military, let's just say that is a large load, of 'bull feces'.

Warpy

(114,389 posts)
50. That fat pig canceled leases by fiat because he don't like windmills?
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:04 PM
Dec 22

Damn, let the lawsuits begin!

Hey, Tubby, what if the next guy doesn't like coal fired power plants? Or golf courses? Your ox can be gored, too

MiHale

(12,626 posts)
54. When this administration crashes...
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:19 PM
Dec 22

The reverberations will be felt worldwide. Alongside all the cheering it may well shake up plate tectonics.

IbogaProject

(5,619 posts)
57. This is a type of "taking"
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:44 PM
Dec 22

Which is prohibited by tge constution. Even if no new leases are given, and unused ones revoked, these should continue as the capital has been comitted. Yes if there are serious and studies of actual risks then a shutdown might be warrented, but this is an excuse papered onto an agenda.

Vinca

(53,353 posts)
58. Did the Department of War come to this conclusion when it was half in the bag or all in the bag?
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 02:54 PM
Dec 22

Samael13

(124 posts)
67. Not surprising
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 05:01 PM
Dec 22

The bastards been pissed at wind since Scotland told him what to go do with himself

YoshidaYui

(44,962 posts)
68. Trump hates windmills and wants them Gone!
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 05:21 PM
Dec 22

Anything to get dirty coal again and freely pollute the air! Maybe more people will die at his hands , he doesn’t care!

calimary

(89,041 posts)
71. "... unwinds damage done by Biden's green agenda"???
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 07:32 PM
Dec 22

A green agenda is a bad thing???

Trying to save and protect our planet is a bad thing???

Maybe it’s just that trump is the one who’s green. Green with ENVY.

Progressive dog

(7,572 posts)
75. They "interfere" with radar
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 09:27 PM
Dec 22

exactly as other radar reflectors do.
Since the windmills are in fixed locations, they will not be seen as moving objects. They are not high enough or solid enough for boats and planes to hide behind. This is obvious BS put out by some of the stupidest people to have ever lived.

Johonny

(25,456 posts)
76. Hope our power grid isnt being taxed by new technology
Mon Dec 22, 2025, 09:32 PM
Dec 22

Or something...

Trump clueless as to our real threats.

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