General Discussion

xocetaceans

(4,345 posts) Mon Dec 22, 2025, 07:55 PM Dec 22

"History Will Judge Them." No It Won't.

This video makes a good point about the role of historians in the production of history. Ultimately, "History won't be kind to them." is just a meaningless balm to soothe losers and the defeated and does not encourage the work necessary to change things.

Look at W and his Invasion of Iraq. He neither cared nor experienced the consequences. Sure, he paints poorly, and someone threw a shoe at him, but what exactly were the consequences to him? How many died as a result of what he and Cheney unleashed? Even Cheney died recently as an untroubled and unjudged old man who only might have had qualms about helping create the circumstances that yielded Trump unto us. But neither of them nor their enablers ever were called to account for the fact that they invaded a country for no legitimate reason and led the US to use torture.

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"History Will Judge Them." No It Won't. (Original Post) xocetaceans Dec 22 OP

"History will judge them" isn't an idle prediction; it's a rallying cry. unblock Dec 22 #1

Perhaps: I can see that as a possible interpretation, but the evidence does not seem to square with that account. n/t xocetaceans Dec 22 #2

Oh, History Will Judge Our Govt War Criminals. The PROBLEM.... ColoringFool Dec 22 #3

Sometimes History takes its time. Collimator Dec 22 #4

Yep... littlemissmartypants Dec 22 #5

W is still basically contemporaneous TimeToGo Dec 22 #6

I'm a historian róisín_dubh Dec 22 #7

unblock

(55,923 posts)

1. "History will judge them" isn't an idle prediction; it's a rallying cry.

Reply to xocetaceans (Original post)

Mon Dec 22, 2025, 08:11 PM

Dec 22

History is written by the victors.

"History will judge them" is a motivator for victims of tyranny to triumph and wield the pen of history and cast the tyrants into the pits of historical hell.

It's a call for action.

xocetaceans

(4,345 posts)

2. Perhaps: I can see that as a possible interpretation, but the evidence does not seem to square with that account. n/t

Reply to unblock (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 22, 2025, 08:17 PM

Dec 22

ColoringFool

(254 posts)

3. Oh, History Will Judge Our Govt War Criminals. The PROBLEM....

Reply to xocetaceans (Original post)

Mon Dec 22, 2025, 08:22 PM

Dec 22

Is that "history," while framed by the victors, is written by historians---Ph.Ds and other learned sorts--- with the more gossipy and juicy stuff written by partisan former members of various Administrations.

IN BOOKS.

IN BOOKS DESTINED TO REMAIN MOSTLY UNREAD AND DEFINITELY UNTAUGHT.

Collimator

(2,080 posts)

4. Sometimes History takes its time.

Reply to xocetaceans (Original post)

Mon Dec 22, 2025, 08:54 PM

Dec 22

Look at the differing attitudes towards Christopher Columbus. As a young teenager, I remember watching a TV news piece about Yale University owning some document that apparently proved Leif Erickson visited the New World before Columbus. The CBS reporter, (I seem to remember the reporter being from CBS), interviewed an Italian-American father who staunchly declared that No Son of His Would Ever Go to Yale because of this grave insult to the memory of Christopher Columbus.

Here we are, decades later, and there are voices on the Right trying desperately to pull us back to the supposed Good Old Days where Men Were Men and everyone knew their place, etc., etc. But the overwhelming consensus among the younger population is that Columbus was not the hero that he was held to be when I was growing up.

New information comes forward, or rather, old information is re-examined by the new generations of historians. Previously unheard voices come forward to tell their side of the story. Attitudes change.

I'm not saying that we don't have to keep up the fight. Progress is by no means guaranteed. But things have a way of shifting. And regardless of the noise generated by various media sources, the majority of people on this planet are looking forward to living in a post Trump world.