I decided to muck about a bit to see how much of a footprint I had, and with a few properly placed inquiries through a proxy friend of mine, I was able to get a frankly alarming amount of information about myself despite having a fairly minimal online presence, down to my address, phone number as well as a general "heat map" of my movements. All through entirely legal inquiries at the right using only my real name.

Now imagine it done at scale through data brokers who make a living doing it.

And if you're willing to spend a bit of money, you can get the full workover. IP address and ISP, activity times, services and utility usage depending on the provider, it's all out there floating around if you know how to ask the questions and where to look.

ETA: Look at Post 5 for a clue of one way among a great many to use the existing system legally.

FURTHER EDIT: And Post 6.

Government employs technologies and armies to surveil the public.

https://www.wired.com/story/the-wired-guide-to-protecting-yourself-from-government-surveillance/

That was unconstitutional until GW Bush and John Roberts made it OK.

As for the point:

Hannah Arendt: The Goal of Wholesale Surveillance



The goal of wholesale surveillance, as (Hannah) Arendt wrote in “The Origins of Totalitarianism,” is not, in the end, to discover crimes, “but to be on hand when the government decides to arrest a certain category of the population.” And because Americans’ emails, phone conversations, Web searches and geographical movements are recorded and stored in perpetuity in government databases, there will be more than enough “evidence” to seize us should the state deem it necessary. This information waits like a deadly virus inside government vaults to be turned against us. It does not matter how trivial or innocent that information is. In totalitarian states, justice, like truth, is irrelevant.

Chris Hedges, The Last Gasp of American Democracy

Any private individual has access if they have the right impetus, using entirely legal means. If they're willing to cross the lines to the illegal, no one is safe, because EVERYTHING is out there on the Net.

So how do individual citizens get and apply the power the government “enjoys”?

Open government does not work for tyrants.

The Government has the ability to actually act on and enforce their will through these services. However, the average private citizen can still make life a living hell for someone (illegally) if so desired. If they want to go to the extreme, a private citizen could use readily available information freely offered on the Net to find, stalk, and harm any number of other individuals anywhere in the country. And a group of private citizens could do the same.

The person I originally responded to made the statement that "Private citizens cannot track you in this way."

I contend that they can, as I did it to myself using a proxy as cover. The government can do it BETTER and can back it up with much more force, but private citizens can certainly access similar if differently obtained information for their own purposes.

That was the whole point of Poindexter's Total Information Awareness program which was, supposedly, scotched because the public way back then (yes, I'm being ironic) did not want it to go forward. Poindexter said the point was to be able to find and follow terrorists. Funny, isn't it, how the f**king Trump Nazis called Renee Good a terrorist after they murdered her? Meaning the Government is not looking for actual terrorists so much as for people it can condemn as terrorists.

But, sadly, the end result is that all 333,000,000 Americans stand naked before the Government. And it was all part of a furtive movement by the mutated Party of Lincoln.

which mirrors the internet. The head of the NSA said when it was commissioned that they wouldn't use the information to go after people, only to connect people and provide information about people of interest. So, basically when they decide that they don't like someone they will have evidence against them.
And I think that we should understand by now that when the government says something against someone most people will believe it, all the more so because the government will have all of the information.

YOU cannot track a neighborhood's worth of phones. You literally can't, so I ahve no idea why you are arging with me, you are wrong.

I work in cycbersecurity every day, I know what I am talking about, so please quick being patronizing.

The op is talking about something law (or "law&quot enforcement now has access to. I'm sure there are tech savvy souls who can easily figure it out. If it is a tool for law enforcement, it needs to be highly regulated.

The problems shift exponentially from there, but your statement is utterly correct. I just take some degree of issue with categorical statements saying "X Can't do Y" when X is clearly capable of doing Y.

I agree with you about the regulation, and most government entities should have severe regulation to prevent abuse of power of this magnitude. Realistically, even if regulation happens, there will be an element that operates independently doing the same thing, and the government can outsource it to a commercial entity to continue surveillance and avoid the governmental regulation. At least, if I'm remembering my business law studies properly.

These are other ways -- not available to the public -- ICE tracks phones.

Purchasing Commercial Location Data:
ICE buys vast amounts of aggregated location data from commercial data brokers to sidestep the need for a warrant. This data, gathered from millions of phones and mobile apps, can reveal historical and current locations of individuals across the U.S.. Tools like PenLink's Webloc and Babel Street's Locate X are used to access and analyze this information.

Cell Site Simulators (Stingrays):
ICE uses devices often referred to as "Stingrays" (like the Stingray II and a newer model called Crossbow). These devices act as fake cell towers, tricking phones in the vicinity into connecting with them, which allows ICE to pinpoint a specific phone's location.

Spyware and Hacking Tools:
The agency has contracts with companies like Paragon Solutions for spyware that can hack into phones and access data, including encrypted messages and location data. A tool called Graphite reportedly can gain complete access to a phone just by sending a message to the number, without the user needing to click a link.

Social Media and Web Scraping:
Tools like PenLink's Tangles and ShadowDragon's SocialNet scrape information from social media and public websites. This data is used to build detailed profiles of targets, linking their posting history, location history, photos, and social connections.

Biometric and Identification Apps:
ICE agents in the field use apps like Mobile Fortify which can identify individuals by pointing a phone's camera at their face and scanning against federal and state databases.

Mobile Device Analytics:
ICE utilizes tools from companies such as Cellebrite and Paragon to analyze the contents of mobile devices, often after they have been seized.

You've left enough of a footprint on this website alone, accessible from a google search not a DU search, since your start that I could reliably look you up, find your cell phone number, possibly your address, definitely your place of work, your real name, possibly a picture.

I'm not saying I WILL and I certainly WON'T but in a five second google search I know enough about you to spook you with absolutely no effort. That's not a threat or anything, nothing of the sort; You insisted that "Private citizens can't track you this way". I'm telling you, yes they can.

EDIT FOR CLARITY: I mean technically it wasn't even a Google search. It was Bing. And Bing isn't exactly known for their comprehensive results.

but my user name here is not connected to my real name at all, so how does that happen?

Stuff that nowadays a dedicated AI could do in a flash, but someone with ill intent could do with 20 minutes and another 4 hours on hold to various agencies.

Quick thirty second examination based purely on your DU name.

I found a very small area in which you at least used to live (may have moved since then.)

I've observed a cookbook you bought from a specific local group narrowing the area.

I've also found some of your medical history as well as details about a doctor that you were seeing in the local area and I THINK I've found her easier than I've found you, which means if I want to go illegal, I have enough information now. If I don't, I could keep digging.

That's purely from a thirty second Bing search, and there are AI designed to do FAR MORE than me far faster.

Did you find my real name as well? Because I've never been able to find anything by googling (as so many suggest).

Tell me, how do you do it? You don't.

lol

Can I do it with the same efficiency? No. In fact I'd take a 99.99% efficiency hit over the government. But it could be done. I could track not only a neighborhood but an entire area code if I wanted to, it'd just increase the amount of time required, all using free, legal means.

You say "You can't." "You don't." I contest your absolute statement and declare that a private individual can and could using legal means, and could do it far faster using illegal means.

Your appeal to authority notwithstanding, I know it's possible. You only suspect it isn't.

You have not detailed any specific methods you use. What specific Bing searches are involved?

Send me a text message when you have my cell number.

You just need to find a signal and have multiple points active in a neighborhood to triangulate on. Totally passive.

L-

https://insights.daffodilsw.com/blog/how-iot-allows-precise-location-based-tracking

You can do it via Cell towers, or via WiFi sensors, or a combination of both.

Fairly trivial to put your own Cell towers into play - that is the basis of Stingray technology. I can pretty much guarantee that ICE is employing this technology.

See: https://www.nacdl.org/Document/CellSiteSimulatorPrimer

Also, WiFi sensors are also fairly easy to setup, though you will need more of them. I've seen plenty of demos where people were identified and tracked as they move through Stores.

L-

.... to purchase the data from data aggregators that collect the data legally and are in the business of selling it. So, yes, private citizens, who can afford it, can track you in this way.

"ICE had purchased two products produced by the American software company Pen-Link"

Pen-Link is a software company composed of "private individuals", and I don't think Pen-Link would have any quams about selling their products to anyone with the money.

Here I an example of the cell phone "tracking" product, which does not track in real time, but instead provides historical data:

until the masses figure out what they are doing with the Flock camera system.
Continuing to call them "license plate readers" is a disservice to all, and in a nefarious way. If people only knew, they would be outraged.

]https://banishbigbrother.com/flock-camera-map/

If you start reading on this subject, at first it almost seems as if it's one of those kook conspiracy theories. But it's not. Coupled with the application of AI, all of your public movements are being recorded, analyzed, and stored, and government (including law enforcement) has access to it all with a simple subscription. Even the bumper stickers on your car are being associated with your identity.

You can also listen to Louis Rossman (youtube) who is heavily involved in consumer rights and privacy issues. He's legit.

We are most certainly in uncharted waters at this point, and it all looks bad for the American citizen.

It happens to be in front of the local loan shark's driveway. Recently, he disappeared. A couple of weeks ago there was a huge estate sale at the enormous brick house he used to live in. Made me wonder if he was the target.

Next time I go that way, I'm going to check and see if it's still there.

I mentioned (Louis Rossman) and a large group are tracking and mapping the spread of this scourge.
In the case anyone is interested:

https://banishbigbrother.com/flock-camera-map/

I'll try harder later. Thanks for sharing this, ForgedCrank. ❤️

That sounds like a good plot for a novel!

And never will!!

Who the hell wants one? Not me, that's for sure!

From the AI thingy (fact-check suggested!):

They are way, way beyond that now.

....talking about how to block this crap:

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2025/06/future-android-phones-could-warn-you-about-data-stealing-fake-cell-towers/

But yeah, ICE are probably using more advanced surveillance tech in addition to or instead of.

Another article from September 2025 that says ICE is using Stingray technology: https://www.forbes.com/sites/the-wiretap/2025/09/09/how-ice-is-using-fake-cell-towers-to-spy-on-peoples-phones/

That purportedly can detect Stingray.

(I wouldn't bet my ass on them, though )

Which is why they are no doubt using more advanced tech.

I was thinking like if someone went to or was in the vicinity of a protest and didn't want to leave a footprint. I know you can always use a clean burner phone if you need one, just wondering if this could work to allow you to keep your phone on you.

RFID wallets are great too, don't get me wrong, but if you want absolute security, leave your cell at home. Get a burner, and whether you use it or not, chuck it at the end of the use you bought it for. If your personal cell phone is on you, it's a liability. From what I hear, RFID wallets are hit or miss as far as some of these new data-tracking techs.

I was going to go into the nitty about using gloves to hold the burner if you're REALLY worried about getting IDed, also to never let the phone hit your face, but that's a bit afield and getting into an almost concerning level of paranoia for something like a protest.

Being a ham radio guy, I have this understanding.

Any time you use a cellphone or even a computer, you are BROADCASTING and should have ZERO expectations of privacy

And yeah, the world's gone so digital that no one's private any more. Unless you unplug and disconnect entirely, which ironically is the best way to be safe nowadays; Finding anonymity in real life by absence, whereas the Net used to hold anonymity paramount.

You can operate on 2 meters for about $20.

Plus, the little bugger can monitor most government and public service frequencies, but you aren't allowed to transmit on them.

Great budget energency/survival gear for the prepared DUer.

I mean, there's been some stuff happening around me that might warrant having a government radio in the background so it may be worth popping a quick fifty bucks on it whenever I have a spare 50 dollars again (If I'm gonna spring for emergency gear I'm not gonna take the bottom of the barrel. XD I'll chuck a few bucks extra to make sure it works.) Thanks for the heads up man!

EDIT: Edit was just to clarify not twenty dollars but fifty for the model I'm seeing.

Where a criminal used a burner.

They didn't have a name but they tracked some data the phone uses to the point of purchase, and the stores surveillance camera had him buying it.

And if you MUST have a phone, the burner must be destroyed to the point where they can't even ID it. Normally melting or burning after a massive electric shock.

One other thing is to make sure you block the signals from your phone well before you arrive at the ultimate destination. If someone detects you a block or so from an event it is easy to infer that you are going there.

But the amount of information out there about you is staggering. Your cell usage not-with-standing.

On the + side personally, I have adapted by becoming more stoic since April of last year. I started returning to normal around the time of the Trump shooting and Biden’s speech in 2024 (not connected obviously - just memory markers) after an extended period of mental upheaval starting in late 2011 and worsening in early 2012. Hideous job where big tech (specifically the defense contracting and data mining parasitic giant that is Google, which pioneered this garbage surveillance Panopticon that the kleptocratic, dim-witted fascists of Palantir etc are now also enthusiastically building) contamination/coup of academic science and medicine showed up in my life for the first time*.

I was and am fond of my mentor at the time-he was a bit of a pain in the neck unlike my mentor. But out of respect for him I tried to pretend to buy into needless shrinking of the militarized and shallow pop type. I should have been firm and said “no..i just hate junk tech and its sleazy blah centrist politics”. But i was too confounded by the sudden transition from my old work spaces to one I hated. God I hate Google. They were handing out geofence warrants to law enforcement up to last year incidentally.

I had/have no mental issues per se beyond this:
https://theconversation.com/how-neoliberalism-is-damaging-your-mental-health-90565
But somehow oddly this realization of my worst fears after that period has had an oddly calming effect.

I also self shrank a bit following stuff like this to understand how my brain works:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-021-24068-x

So I am feeling better personally and coping well despite the hellish state of the world. Its weirder to be alone in hell. I am starting the next phase of recovery focusing on attention/distraitness.



(*: I trash big tech all the time, but i do make limited exceptions for any scientists personally known to the few scientists or doctors I trust completely. It is not entirely inconceivable that there could exist even at Google, someone I ..consider..a person whom a friend or colleague, could conceivably almost not entirely not be acquainted with. Though still extremely unlikely.)

“The best rope money can buy.”

This is what you get.

Unless you are an experienced programmer or hacker, there are reams of information about you online. REAMS.

You can't stop it without major expense and technical help.

This is because we let those corporate bastards 'willy-nilly' integrate the internet into every aspect of of their operations within a few years of the technology being introduced, and therefore it became apart of your operations, because you cannot interact with most of them without doing it through the internet. Once that connection is made, are you really sure that they are playing fair? How do you confirm this? What information do they get when you try to ask them a question on the web? Do you know? Are you sure?

Face it, we do not know.

Also, using 'social media' to point this out is ironically hysterical.

...wrote purported journalist Shane Proteus in a social media post on X Sunday night.

https://www.consumeraffairs.com/news/california-launches-one-click-system-to-delete-personal-data-from-hundreds-of-brokers-010626.html

California launches one-click system to delete personal data from hundreds of brokers

James R. Hood, Founder and Editor
Jan. 6, 2026

A new California law lets residents demand deletion of their personal data from hundreds of data brokers with a single request

The system replaces a cumbersome process that required consumers to contact each broker individually

Privacy advocates say the change could significantly reduce the mass collection and resale of personal information

… more …

They can see all cell phones in a given area and do this regularly. It’s one of the ways they had names during the January 6th insurrection.

Just wondering. I keep mine off except when I get lost and need GPS, which is not very often

Then you can be pinpointed. Your cell strength is just triangulated between 3 towers.

If your phone is on, you can be seen. If you are in a modern car, it likely has gps.

License plates are read constantly at toll roads and some intersections or by driving cops and towing companies.

You don’t read about serial killers anymore, not because there are less whack jobs than in the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s. It’s largely because they are caught early.

Lots of good information in that show about the surveillance state; Not accurate or factual, but also not entirely fiction either.

The odor of actions without consequence and behavior without oversight.

Yes we all know Big Brother is watching since we are pretty much forced to interact with big data via the internet. And this intrusion on our privacy is now seen as the cost of doing business. Most financial transactions are conducted via phone/internet connections and merchants and banks are connected in that vital link. And even your home's utilities are connected in that way too. Fewer transactions are made in cash and merchants often have a hard time handling cash so it seems like cash may one day be made obsolete and everyone will be forced to make digital transactions. But what if you can be excluded from doing business by a malign government? I'm not very tech savvy, but notice what the Iranian regime has done in the wake of protests. Reports say they "turned off" the internet and cell phones. And everyone is blinded. So if such a thing can happen there, when does it happen here? And might a denial of service be specifically targeted at individuals and groups in the US which the Trump regime deems terrorists? I recall some quasi-biblical reference to The Mark Of The Beast which says those which didn't bear the mark would be banned from trading unless they swore allegiance to the beast. So everyone must submit to being "licensed" by the government to access the internet. Paranoia runs deep.

we're supposed the right to privacy? yeah?

I am not recommending this particular product. I link there only because there is a decent explanation of what a Faraday bag does.

https://www.empshield.com/whats-a-faraday-bag-and-why-should-you-care/

It wouldn't cause me any anguish to get rid of mine and it doesn't cause me any anguish when I forget to take it with me.

I'm pretty much a Luddite that way. I have a no-contract flip phone that I mostly use as a phone. Sometimes I send and receive texts on it which is something my home phone can't do.

DU is my only social media and I block all the rest, including bluesky. It's not because I'm paranoid, it's just all too much noise for me. I quit Amazon when Bezos got too chummy with the-one-who-shall-not-be-named.

I don't see any internet or television advertising. My truck is old and doesn't have any "smart" features.

All those things probably give me a rather suspicious electronic signature should the government ever decides to kick down the doors of dissidents like me.

within the cell tower.

Never forget. Him. This. And him for this.