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Wicked Blue

(7,692 posts)
Fri Feb 14, 2025, 07:16 PM Feb 14

U.S.-Russia Talks are 'obsolete' after Chernobyl Drone Strike -- Kallas

Source: Moscow Times

MUNICH — The European Union’s top diplomat said that any talks between the United States and Russia were now “obsolete” following a drone strike at Ukraine’s Chernobyl nuclear power plant that Kyiv blamed on Moscow.

“It clearly shows that [the Russians] don't want peace,” EU foreign policy chief Kaja Kallas told journalists on the sidelines of the Munich Security Conference. “All these other talks have been totally obsolete because of the bombing of the nuclear station, bombing of civilians, bombing of civilian infrastructure.

“What is up to us right now is to decide and discuss how we support Ukraine right now in this endeavor because our values haven't changed, the goals of Russia haven't changed either, so we need to stick to our ground and really see what is at stake here.”

Earlier this week at the NATO defense ministers' meeting in Brussels, Kallas had accused U.S. President Donald Trump of “appeasement” following his conversation with Russia’s Vladimir Putin and stressed that any peace deal must be negotiated with European and Ukrainian involvement.

Read more: https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2025/02/14/us-russia-talks-obsolete-after-chernobyl-drone-strike-kallas-a88015

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U.S.-Russia Talks are 'obsolete' after Chernobyl Drone Strike -- Kallas (Original Post) Wicked Blue Feb 14 OP
Do I ever True Dough Feb 14 #1
Europe knows that MFer fully intends to throw Ukraine under the bus. maxsolomon Feb 14 #2
If ruskie govt wanted peace, they would gtf out of the soverign nation of Ukraine! SheltieLover Feb 14 #3
Reminds me of some lines from the 1940 Three Stooges film "You Nazsty Spy" Wicked Blue Feb 14 #4
I'm glad this was posted but, are there any other sources besides the Moscow Times? red dog 1 Feb 14 #5
I found it on a Belgian news site, rtbf, but it links to the article in French Wicked Blue Feb 14 #6
Yeah, I saw that one too. red dog 1 Feb 14 #8
The Moscow Times isn't at all associated with the Kremlin and is usually reliable Emrys Feb 14 #11
A comprehensuve list of modern times when Russia wanted peace: GreenWave Feb 14 #7
Let Ukraine be unleashed. Since they have been sold out by Orange Boy, let NATO give them what they need. Evolve Dammit Feb 14 #9
'It shows once again that Russia is not looking for peace,' says EU Foreign Policy Chief Kaja Kallas. C0RI0LANUS Feb 14 #10
A way too easy reaction to an extremely stupid accident! TomWilm Feb 15 #12
accident? lapfog_1 Feb 15 #13
Russian attack drones also recently crashed in Latvia, Moldova, Poland and Romania ... TomWilm Feb 15 #14
in Romania, Russia is trying to attack the border crossing with Ukraine lapfog_1 Feb 15 #15
Don't attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity ... TomWilm Feb 15 #17
During a violent, watime conflict, attribiution to malice is the standard rather than the exception. Torchlight Feb 15 #21
The fact these "accidents" by the Russians happen with regularity isn't exactly comforting Emrys Feb 15 #16
You realize that that is an absurd argument, right? mahina Feb 16 #27
You are a Putin apologist NickB79 Feb 15 #18
... nice logic there ... TomWilm Feb 15 #19
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 15 #20
Your argument speaks for itself NickB79 Feb 15 #23
Keep dreaming of wars with a glorious victory ... TomWilm Feb 15 #24
The Ukrainians are dreaming of survival. Emrys Feb 15 #25
Oh, please... your holier than thou perception of the fighting back of The Ukrainians.. electric_blue68 Feb 16 #26
Amen! Wicked Blue Feb 15 #22

True Dough

(22,150 posts)
1. Do I ever
Fri Feb 14, 2025, 07:19 PM
Feb 14

admire the leadership of Kaja Kallas. Between her and Zelensky, just stellar individuals to be heads of state (or EU foreign policy chief, in Kallas's case now).

maxsolomon

(36,005 posts)
2. Europe knows that MFer fully intends to throw Ukraine under the bus.
Fri Feb 14, 2025, 07:19 PM
Feb 14

And if he can do the same to the EU, all the better.

Europe snubbed him; he will have his revenge.

Wicked Blue

(7,692 posts)
4. Reminds me of some lines from the 1940 Three Stooges film "You Nazsty Spy"
Fri Feb 14, 2025, 07:46 PM
Feb 14

Moe Hailstone, Curly Gallstone, Larry Pebble: "Peace! We want peace!"

Vance Rippemup: "Yes. A piece of this and a piece of that country."

Wicked Blue

(7,692 posts)
6. I found it on a Belgian news site, rtbf, but it links to the article in French
Fri Feb 14, 2025, 08:28 PM
Feb 14

Estonian public broadcasting ERR has the Belgian article, but without a link.

Emrys

(8,404 posts)
11. The Moscow Times isn't at all associated with the Kremlin and is usually reliable
Fri Feb 14, 2025, 10:25 PM
Feb 14

In fact, it's been banned in Russia for a couple of years:

The Moscow Times is an Amsterdam-based independent English-language and Russian-language online newspaper. It was in print in Russia from 1992 until 2017 and was distributed free of charge at places frequented by English-speaking tourists and expatriates, such as hotels, cafés, embassies, and airlines, and also by subscription. The newspaper was popular among foreign citizens residing in Moscow and English-speaking Russians. In November 2015, the newspaper changed its design and type from daily to weekly (released every Thursday) and increased the number of pages to 24.

The newspaper became online-only in July 2017 and launched its Russian-language service in 2020. In 2022, its headquarters were relocated to Amsterdam in the Netherlands in response to restrictive media laws enacted in Russia after the invasion of Ukraine. On 15 April 2022, the Russian-language website of The Moscow Times was blocked in Russia. In 2023, the Ministry of Justice of Russia designated the paper as a "foreign agent". On 10 July 2024, the office of the Russian Prosecutor General announced that the newspaper was declared an undesirable organization.

Some American foreign correspondents started their careers at the paper, including Ellen Barry, who later became The New York Times' Moscow bureau chief.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Moscow_Times

Evolve Dammit

(20,263 posts)
9. Let Ukraine be unleashed. Since they have been sold out by Orange Boy, let NATO give them what they need.
Fri Feb 14, 2025, 08:38 PM
Feb 14

We will NEVER be trusted again. Vlad must be peeing himself with joy.

TomWilm

(1,885 posts)
12. A way too easy reaction to an extremely stupid accident!
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 06:25 AM
Feb 15

... if Russia really wanted to attack the old Chernobyl power plant, it would not be by a single drone smashing into the roof. This is clearly just an alarming accident, which again shows how dangerous such wars can be for the whole world - and how filling more arms into that area is only making it worse. So much fighting and killing, and the frontline has barely moved in years ...

lapfog_1

(30,684 posts)
13. accident?
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 08:53 AM
Feb 15

tell me please, what military asset is even close to the Chernobyl Nuclear site?



The Chernobyl Sarcophagus is one of the larger buildings in the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl_Nuclear_Power_Plant_sarcophagus

The Chernobyl Nuclear Power Plant sarcophagus or Shelter Structure (Ukrainian: Об'єкт "Укриття", romanized: Ob'yekt "Ukryttya", Russian: Объект «Укрытие», romanized: Ob"yekt «Ukrytiye») is a massive steel and concrete structure covering the nuclear reactor number 4 building of the Chernobyl Nuclear Power Plant. Hastily built in the aftermath of the 1986 Chernobyl disaster, the sarcophagus was designed to limit radioactive contamination of the environment by encasing the most dangerous area and protecting it from climate exposure.[1][2] The sarcophagus locked in 200 tons of radioactive lava-like corium, 30 tons of highly contaminated dust and 16 tons of uranium and plutonium.[1]

Structurally, the sarcophagus is largely supported by the damaged reactor building. By 1996, the structure had deteriorated to the point where numerous stabilization measures were required. Internal radiation levels were estimated to be as high as 10000 röntgens per hour in certain areas (normal background radiation in cities is usually around 20–50 microröntgens per hour, and a lethal dose is 500 röntgens over 5 hours).[3] By 2017, the sarcophagus was surrounded by the New Safe Confinement structure, which is designed to protect the environment while the sarcophagus undergoes demolition and the nuclear cleanup continues. The reactor site is located within a large restricted area known as the Chernobyl Exclusion Zone.

This will be an extremely hazardous ( to all of eastern Europe, Belarus, and even Russia, not to mention Ukraine ) site until we can develop and deploy the needed radioactive resistive robots that can go into the site and remove all of the material from there... and figure out what to do with it all ). So far, in the last 40 years, few solutions have been offered.

bombing this site was no accident.

TomWilm

(1,885 posts)
14. Russian attack drones also recently crashed in Latvia, Moldova, Poland and Romania ...
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 10:02 AM
Feb 15

... what military assets are close to there?

lapfog_1

(30,684 posts)
15. in Romania, Russia is trying to attack the border crossing with Ukraine
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 10:24 AM
Feb 15

on the Danube river. Military supplies travel this route from EU countries into Ukraine.

I am well aware of Russian drone strikes in Romania. When the war started I sent my girlfriend to the border to welcome the Ukrainian refugees streaming over the Danube with little belonging... She was part of a massive Romanian response who welcomed the refugees with toys for the children and blankets and, most importantly, money to help them get into Europe and get official aid from governments.

Russia is also trying to stop the exports of grain and other goods to hurt the Ukraine economy.

Definitely targeted. There are no battles being fought in these areas, but all of them are likely targeted...

Moldova actually has Russian troops in an area named Transnistria.. The Moldovan government would like them to all leave but doesn't want to start a war with Russia to do it.

Poland and Ukraine share a longer border than Romania and Ukraine. It is another place where there are large movements of military equipment into Ukraine. So that's not an accident either.

As for Latvia... I am pretty sure Russia want to start something there, so probably not an accident. More of a warning shot saying "you guys in the Baltic states are next"

Your assertion that Russia is just having a number of accidents is likely Kremlin propaganda. You should check your sources before making such claims.

TomWilm

(1,885 posts)
17. Don't attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity ...
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 10:50 AM
Feb 15

... and that stupidity is what Putin's government is most famous for, much more than skills or resourcefulness. That is why he is stuck with a war for years, which was promised to be concluded in weeks. And as your "analysis" shows, Putin is still saluted as if he is a skilled three-dimensional chess player - some one must be trusting that Kremlin propaganda way too much, and it is not me!

Torchlight

(4,306 posts)
21. During a violent, watime conflict, attribiution to malice is the standard rather than the exception.
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 11:57 AM
Feb 15

and the excuse then given should itlsef be supported by evidence. You have not.

Emrys

(8,404 posts)
16. The fact these "accidents" by the Russians happen with regularity isn't exactly comforting
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 10:33 AM
Feb 15

Someone else has addressed the rationales for strikes on Ukraine's supportive neighbours. One could be put down to carelessness and incompetence; numerous ones looks more like a concerted campaign with frequent oopsies.

In terms of Chornobyl, you have to think in terms of terrorism - just like Putin's urban strike with his Wunderwaffe Oreshnik, this attack wasn't intended to produce all-out obliteration, it's part of Putin's campaign of intimidation and disruptive "what if" scenarios.

The Russians have been occupying and menacing Ukrainian nuclear power plants since early in this latest hot phase of the war, to the extent that the IAEA has had to put up a permanent presence in them to have staff in place to try to cope with any more "mishaps".

A strike on any of the outlying support facilities for these plants, as has happened before, could be even more serious than a hit on them directly - they require backup power to operate relatively safely, which has at times been compromised, which has led to desperate scrambles.

A "stupid accident" here, another one there, and pretty soon you have full-blown disaster.

The symbolic power of the Chornobyl name and the timing in these early stages of possible negotiations are a bit too much of a coincidence to be written off cavalierly as you're doing.

So, as you've already been asked, what "legitimate" wartime target in the vicinity of Chornobyl do you suggest they were aiming for?

NickB79

(19,794 posts)
18. You are a Putin apologist
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 10:54 AM
Feb 15

This line of yours right here says it all. Straight out of the pro-Russian propaganda playbook arguing to stop supporting Ukraine and let Russia keep it's ill-gotten gains.

filling more arms into that area is only making it worse. So much fighting and killing, and the frontline has barely moved in years ...

TomWilm

(1,885 posts)
19. ... nice logic there ...
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 11:37 AM
Feb 15

... return with arguments, if you ever find some .

I remember those nice olden days here at DU, when it was still possible to be against war, without getting such weird attacks!

Response to TomWilm (Reply #19)

NickB79

(19,794 posts)
23. Your argument speaks for itself
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 01:59 PM
Feb 15

It's the same one MAGA has used for years. Basically, let Russia take Ukraine as a "humanitarian option", because the war itself is so bloody.

Ignoring that Russia started it, Ukraine has the right and desire to defend themselves, that Russia will keep killing Ukrainians in captured territory even after the war ends because they'll be an occupation force, and that Russia will just rearm and come back in a few years for more.

Appeasement of a dictator is a game for fools.

TomWilm

(1,885 posts)
24. Keep dreaming of wars with a glorious victory ...
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 02:28 PM
Feb 15

... so brave. Ready to keep on "fighting" until the last Ukrainian is killed.

Emrys

(8,404 posts)
25. The Ukrainians are dreaming of survival.
Sat Feb 15, 2025, 03:55 PM
Feb 15

We in Europe are in solidarity with them.

But you can sit in comfort feeling pure in the safety of distance because you won't sanction a country continuing to defend itself against literal genocide, cheered on by Trump and his cronies. So that's good.

electric_blue68

(20,171 posts)
26. Oh, please... your holier than thou perception of the fighting back of The Ukrainians..
Sun Feb 16, 2025, 12:45 AM
Feb 16
against a blood thirsty, murderous Bully!

I highly prefer diplomacy, but sometimes you have to fight back!
Unless you yourself in a situation would let yourself be say beaten to severe debilitating injury or death. Well, this is what Putin is doing to Ukraine. Running roughehod over a free, independent country.

It's up to The Ukrainian people to decide when to stop fighting. If President Zelenskyy decides it's time to try to settle the war that's his perogative as the leader of his country. But drumphf and putin "negotiating","deciding for" Ukraine without Z and advisors sitting at the table; that sucks! That's not a genuine negotiation.

If the "agreement" sucks, will Zelenskyy continue to fight? He might have to have a referendum with his country's people?

I hope Ukraine will ceed no more territory to Russia. I hope but doubt they'll get anything back..

Fuck putin!
Slava Ukraini!
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