them the stats on the pollution caused in beef production compared to ANYTHING else polluting Their planet .

I don't think they can process that at this age

I'll cook meat for my kids, but just really can't eat it anymore. As a result I eat very little of anything. At least I'm keeping a healthy size, just lack energy. Sigh.

If you want meat, you must kill the animal yourself!

I could see my 7-yo daughter trying to do that, running at the cows in the hills with a fork and knife

I mean, you might as well. The sad thing is that because the meat industry is subsidized, a lot of it is cheaper than salads. Rather than a theistic all-or-nothing approach, try having meat just a couple times per week. You'll accomplish most of what you want without having to feel like you are giving up something, because you won't be.

I'm not saying you're wrong, just want to know.

Same with oil and even tobacco.

the meat industry or is it indirectly with subsidies to corn?

& how most of the corn grown goes to two places, animal feed & HFCS. Big agra farming is completely different than mom-pop farms. You should see the size of the equipment they use now. When they purchase a family farm, they usually doze the house & any outbuildings, because it's wasted space & it's easier to plow/plant the fields without having to maneuver around the buildings. Highly recommended film!

http://www.kingcorn.net/

They might directly subsidize the meat industry, too, I don't know.

Then you can pen them up too.

Last edited Sun Sep 15, 2013, 04:40 PM - Edit history (1)

An old standby favorite: http://vegweb.com/recipes

A new fave: http://fatfreevegan.com/

And another one: http://blog.fatfreevegan.com/

Cook books:

Vegan with a Vengeance
How it all Vegan
Vegnomicon

First, identify at least two comfort foods & learn how to remake them veggie. This will see you through when you are craving old foods. For me it was open face turkey sandwiches & sausage gravy with biscuits. Then you need to identify the types of things you eat on a regular basis & figure out how to convert/replace those dishes.

Hats off to you & your family for taking action! The veggie way is better for your health, the planet & definitely the animals.

Come back & ask more questions. We love to talk food.

We ate a vegan diet for about a year, but around then my thyroid issues really kicked in and we fell off the wagon and haven't gotten back on.

My partner and son tolerated meat replacements, but for me that just didn't cut it. What worked for me was learning new meals that weren't based on animal products and playing around until I figured out what I could eat without being utterly miserable. We actually found a recipe for sloppy joes using lentils that is pretty awesome, and stuff like chili is easy to make meat-free. We still make those meals vegetarian.

It isn't easy, particularly for the kids. "Shitty tasting food" is really subjective. The first time I tried to roast a duck the result was pretty shitty, and I LOVE duck. The same is true for vegetarian recipes. It will take some time before you learn how to make new meals properly. And on the other side of things, you have get your taste buds out of their comfortable rut. I'm fine with vegetables for the most part. However, for the first 25 yrs of my life I hated onions. Hated them as a child whether I was allowed to pick them off or forced to eat them. As an adult I flat out refused to eat them at all. It got to the point where eating them made me feel kind of queasy. At that point I decided I needed to get some control on it, and began inserting them into my food intentionally. At first I felt kind of sick to my stomach, but eventually that stopped and slowly I got used to them. Now, certain foods don't taste right if they are in/on it. "Shitty tasting" is often your mouth's way of throwing a temper tantrum about changing your diet.

I wish you a lot of good luck with it and hope you find something that will work for your family.

MorningStar Farms and Boca both have very good meat substitutes. Their crumblers resemble ground hamburger and can be used to make things you already make with ground meat: hamburger helper, sloppy Joe's, stews, chili etc. They have excellent breaded chicken substitute patties too. I would not try the bacon substitute until you've not eaten any real bacon for a very, very long time or you will be sadly disappointed. Their premade hamburgers are very good and can also be breaded to make a chicken fried steak type meal. Quoran makes some very good pork-ish and beef roast substitutes and a good turkey or chicken substitute (not breaded) that can be cooked alone or used for things like chicken and dumplings. Morning star corn dogs are a favorite in my house too.

Thanksgiving I usually get a Tofurkey feast that is sold at our local health food store (Sprouts). Make it according to the package instructions the first time and after that you can make it your own by making the "basting sauce" with ingredients you like (I use peach preserves and a touch of wine and it's very good.) The feast comes with gravy and the "turkey" roll is prestuffed with a nice rice stuffing but I also make a pan of stuffing using vegetarian chicken flavored broth or bouillion, onions, celery, and lots of mushrooms. Very tasty. Many carnivors in my family prefer my stuffing to the other stuffing brought by family memebers who add meat products.

Good luck and happy eating!

Otherwise, it looks like an Islamic brand (if there is such a thing) due to the spelling of the Quran

Gardein is a relatively new company making meat analogues, and they are quite tasty at that!

And while I know that Whole Foods is almost universally hated here on DU, one thing they have going for them is that their prices on meat analogues is often less than the other "normal" stores (I've seen a 1$ difference on the frozen packages.) Why? Because they go through the fake-meat product faster. I've never seen frost buildup on their stored product, unlike at say my local Kroger. I'd shop at HEB more often if they even sold the brands I like. Unfortunately, they're just not as veggie-friendly as they could be. And so, I shop at Whole Foods.

and that brand has the most "mouth feel" of meat so far and the near umami. I like Boca next followed by Morningstar Farms. I hear there are some new things coming to this realm soon. I have tried the burgers and the chicken piccata...both very tasty and make a good substitute. I recommend you buy some Fortified Nutritional Yeast...and use that to flavor things. That helps me alot.

...tractors cruising over the fields planting and harvesting your grains and vegetables crush all sorts of animals in the ground. Trucks transporting your food kill animals. Trees being cut down to build your home kill animals.

You can find many, many recipes and general ideas on the inner tubes..
including meat substitutes, if you choose to include that route...

Having grown up a carnivore in NJ decades ago, I find I need to fool myself occasionally and eat something that..feels like meat, whether I make it or sometimes even buy packaged frozen meatless meat 'dishes.'

Glad you made the decision. If you and your family can get through the beginning stages, I think you will be glad also.

EDIT: And to add to USAF's list-- Gardein...

in the beginning...paradigm shift.

Baked vegetables in foil or roasted (incredible flavor) ... potatoes, beets, sweet potatoes ... Add a topping for extra flavor. Soups...spit pea with ham, vegetable beef, cutting down on the meat a bit at a time. Cheese and butter are good fill in sometimes. Eggs...from quiche to a quick scramble with a bit of bacon or sausage or egg salad. Wraps are quick and easy and highly flavorful...dressings help. Salads with nuts and raisins or craisins or seeds. Home made dressings are quick and easy and cheap and store in the refrigerator for a long time.

Steaks or meatloaf as entres become secondary as small meatballs or some beef chopped up in a stew. Snacks as fresh fruits, peanut butter balls rolled in coconut, granola bars...homemade is fun it you have the time. If you have a good blender, fruit smoothies fresh or frozen in ice cube trays. Bagels and cream cheese with strawberry jam bites. Pita chips with hummus, too. Shred cheese on a rice tortilla, microwave, roll it up and eat.

A good food processor or a chopping device which can be picked up for $20...one of the few things As Seen On TV that I've had for years. It's often the drudgery of chopping and slicing up the vegetables that put off some...takes time. But with one of these, you can have onions and potatoes diced for hash, or a couple of chopped sweet potatoes for boiling and mashing, in a very short time.

Maybe task the kids with finding recipes online for the family. There are some good websites upthread and lots of fun cookbooks at the library. The fun part is to get everyone's participation in some way...whether recipe hunting, shopping or chopping for food prep...but with kids, if you can make it a game or a challenge and fun it stands a better chance of success.

Good luck ... it's definitely worth it.

Maybe a vegetarian meal a couple times a week. As you find things that the whole family likes, it's easier to find other things like that to then try. The biggest thing for me was learning to cook. It's not that meat is for simpletons, but it's pretty tough to screw up chicken or steak.

Head to Amazon.com (or check out Leftymom's pinned recipe thread at the top) and find a few popular veggie cookbooks. You'll want one that has a good bit of "junk" or pleasure food in it, having two young-uns.

Good luck, Tav. I wish you success and your family much health. Do come back and visit and let us know how it goes.

Last edited Sun Sep 15, 2013, 07:46 PM - Edit history (1)

I'd recommend getting the whole family involved in making more humane choices.

Let's take eggs for example. If you and your family consciously chose to only buy eggs from local farms that treat their chickens humanely, you could continue to spend the same amount (or slightly less) of your food budget on eggs, but you would probably consume a lot fewer eggs because they're more expensive. You would eat more fruits and vegetables to make up the calories. All around healthier options. But the eggs you do consume would also be better quality and without the lifetime of cruelty experienced by factory-farmed animals. Plus, you would be removing yourself from the supply-and-demand cycle for factory farmed products. And when you only have one fairly expensive egg every couple of weeks or so, you tend to value and savor more.

Now extrapolate that approach to other animal products. Soon you're increasing the market demand for healthier foods and humane farming practices while decreasing the market demand for the worst, cruelest practices. You're family is healthier while not being deprived. It's a sustainable approach, and without becoming preachy you can set an example for your friends and neighbors.

I'm hoping that this is an approach that will spread. I'm vegan, but I'd rather have a million "mostly-vegetarians" who eschew factory farm products (hopefully some day to make factory farms a thing of the past) than a few perfect vegans and a million people who can't begin to imagine life without meat every day.

Reduce the amount of meat in each meal.
Reduce the number of meals you have that contain meat.
Have meat and experiment with side dishes - you'll find out that way which sides the family loves best.

I would try to ease into it in a way that feels natural for the kids, instead of focusing on what you're doing without.

At first, we committed to one vegetarian meal a week. When everyone was
happy with that, we went to two and so on. I also selected one meat that
was the easiest to give up and just stopped eating it. For me, it was pigs.

I love pigs; they are smart; and I was never that crazy about pork products.

It has been over twenty years since we have eaten any meats. We made the changes
that were comfortable when it felt right. And we have never wanted to go back
to eating meat, not once.

That is great. I, too, gave up pork for the same reason. If they are as smart as dogs, then why do we eat them? Not to mention subject them to the factory farm system?

My main reason for giving up animal products is for my own health, but it makes me happy to know it is better for other creatures and the earth, too.

I've been on crazy diets all my life and couldn't stick to them. I've done the low-carb thing and couldn't stick to it either. But going plant based seems to be what my body needs to thrive--what we all need to eat to thrive. Once you get over the brain-washing that we get from grade school on, about having to eat so much animal and dairy protein, (as if we could ever be deficient of protein in this country), we can allow ourselves to eat what we naturally need for sustained health.

This began for me in 2000, then in 2011 I went mostly plant-based. I still get a little egg white in things like lowfat mayo, but I'm pretty much animal product free now.

Get a good general cookbook that is not written by a restaurant chef. Look through it and find a few recipes that look good. Try them out, first one day a week, then two, then three, and so forth. Build up family favorites slowly until you look forward to the meatless days.

A vegetarian diet can be cheap if you avoid convenience foods. It can be nutritious if you avoid junk foods.

I highly recommend it.

And research recipes. To equate going vegetarian to having shitty tasting food strikes as me as a profound lack of knowledge about vegetarian meals.

Personally, I'd forego the meat substitutes. Why bother?

Cook yourself. It's not that hard. Explore cuisines that offer lots of vegetarian dishes.

There used to be a strictly vegetarian Indian restaurant in Overland Park, KS. Alas, they went out of business, but it was wonderful.

Oh, and I myself am an enthusiastic meat eater, but there's an awful lot of good food out there that does not include meat.

Sadly I have no idea how to cook without some animal product. Going a meal without butter is a frightening prospect to me. And then of course there's things like worchestershire sauce (anchovies), bases and stocks, all these other things that I can't work without.

Is seafood still on the menu? Cheese? "Scraps" (i.e., ham bones for soup, boullion cubes, that sort of thing)?

For straight-up vegetables, my go-to items are...

- rice
- potatoes
- mushrooms
- summer squashes
- black or kidney beans
- eggplant
- spinach

I've found that these can be tossed together in any number of ways - of course carrots and onions figure as well, but carrots are a seasoning to me, and I can't imagine cooking ANYTHING without onions! I also find I eat a lot of arugula - a whole box of hte stuff is only about four bucks where I am, and it's super-tasty.

Chickpeas are another staple - homemade falafel and hummus is great, be sure to invest in tahini for both! Lentils are another great one - though I hated them as a kid, so yours might as well.

Breads of all sorts, both wheat and corn, are regular features no matter what I'm cooking. Olive oil as well - even the cheap stuff is better than canola for everything except deep frying (so.. .you'll want your regular vegetable oil for that falafel)

other vegetables... maybe not so much. I don't use tomatoes for much of anything, nor broccoli or cauliflower. I use sweet peppers for plenty pf things, and jicama is a new-found favorite, but i haven't figured out just what to do with it. i love avocadoes for everything, but for hte quality we get in Washington, they're usually way too expensive.

Also don't ignore the potential of tofu or seitan. I haven't used seitan for anything, but tofu actually isn't half-bad, so long as you remember you've got to do things to it to make it edible (plain tofu tastes like a wet shoe, but will pick up any flavor you put to it, and prepared, has a surprisingly "meaty" texture - the last i had ended up tasting and feeling like a somewhat dry pork chop)

===================

As libdem4life points out, something as simple as thinking about a vegetable with meat as a side or garnish, rather than meat as the entree with veggies on the side, will go a long way to weaning off the "all meat" approach. soups are a great way to do this - a black bean soup that uses a little bit of ham and a little chicken stock, can be a central entree all on its own, with just a cornbread muffin and some sour cream for the top!

Explore other cuisines - most "ethnic" cuisines outside of the eurosphere are very sparing with meat; while much of modern eurocentric cuisine is derived from what the lords and ladies had at their table, a lot of "ethnic" cuisine and restraunt is the diet of workers and peasants in those societies, and so really work to stretch the meat. Authentic Chinese, Japanese, and Mexican meals mostly use meat for flavor and occasionally texture. Indian and Ethiopian meals are just as sparing, and have lots of full-on vegetarian options (though unless you have a large Ethiopian community near you, good luck finding that stuff). A lot of more "rustic" European dishes are the same way - a little bit of meat tossed in the pot with vegetables for a stew, diced sausages to make a few days' worth of rice and beans a little more eventful, that sort of thing.

John was heir-apparent to the Baskin-Robbins ice cream throne, but turned it down to do his own thing, which was showing the world how our choices affect EVERYTHING. It's a very eye-opening book.

seems to me no matter how far you get you've set an example of thoughtfulness and compassionate thinking for your children. There's no limits to what good that may led to in their lives.

That's it just a thank you, plenty of others here have given sound advice.

I can't believe all the people on this thread claiming that vegan food is somehow tasteless.

News flash: when you're no longer stuffing yourself with animal fat, vegetables start to taste better!

My husband and I have been on a plant-based diet for seven months now. Previously, we both loved meat. He liked hamburgers and pizza, and I liked rare steak and sashimi. Then we saw "Vegucated." I also read "Eating Animals" by Jonathan Safran Foer. After that, it was all about buying vegan cookbooks. Here are a few good ones:

The Mediterranean Vegan Kitchen

Everyday Vegan

Vegan Cooking for Carnivores

Anyone who claims vegan diets are tasteless are kidding themselves and making excuses to try to feel less guilty about their eating habits. Here is some of what we've had over the last couple of weeks:
Home-made tomato pizza
Home-made gnocchi with pesto sauce
Creme brulee (made with pureed cashews)
Flan (made with soymilk and tofu)
Chocolate pudding (made with almond milk)
Tabouli
Spaghetti with tomatoes and basil
Home-made baked beans
Lentils with shallots, olive oil, and balsamic vinegar
Cannellini beans with kale
Can your animal-based diet beat that? (FYI, my husband does most of the cooking, and I make the desserts.)

If you eat no meat, milk and eggs are perfect proteins

If you are vegan, you have to have rice and beans with EVERY meal or you die

That is outdated information--the idea that you have to combine certain foods to form complete proteins. If you have them within several days, it's still okay. Lots of plant based foods contain protein--even pasta and potatoes, and no, it isn't inferior protein to the kind found in animal foods--it's just as good or even better.

Sorry but milk isn't such a great food: dairy is related to hormone-influenced cancers like of the breast and prostate. All animal proteins attack the body in various ways over time, like slow poisons. And the animal fats are also not good for us. I know I sound like a radical, but I am convinced that our bodies were designed to consume primarily fruits, vegetables and grains, and everything else makes us sick eventually, if we eat too much of it.

The American diet is too high in fat, protein and sugar, and we have health epidemics of obesity, diabetes, etc. to show for it.

Recommended reading: The Starch Solution by John McDougall, Forks over Knives, and these guys (The Engine 2 guys) have a very tasty approach to plant-based eating with great recipes that will satisfy: http://www.amazon.com/Beef-Meat-Healthiest-Plant-Strong-ebook/dp/B00AG0VMTC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1380425510&sr=8-2&keywords=engine+2+diet+cookbook Their recipes will appeal to kids who are used to standard American dishes.

There is an endless variety of recipes you can find in cookbooks and on the web. www.vegweb.com is a good one for starters. I don't have time to try all the good ones I see! Last night we had "beefsteak" fajitas made with whole wheat tortillas, portabella mushrooms cooked and cut into strips and seasoned so they tasted meaty like steak, with onion and bell pepper slices and shredded cabbage. We had brown rice to go with it, and some corn chowder made with frozen corn, a can of green chiles and non-dairy milk.

The funniest thing about becoming a vegan is how other people always think we are depriving ourselves. It's anything but a diet of deprivation-- it is delicious! You just learn to add other things when you take out the animal products. I will say, though, that there is a period of "withdrawal" when you go vegetarian--maybe 3-4 weeks, where you will miss the old foods. But that goes away and you really begin to enjoy the new way. I did it a little bit slower. I gave up red meat first, then about 10 years later gave up the chicken and dairy all at once. Still ate fish about every two weeks. But now, two years later, I'm even tapering off on that--just not enjoying it very much anymore.

Protein is in almost everything, including vegetables, so unless you're living on junk food, you'll be ingesting enough protein. In fact, most omnivores get too much protein. Take a look at this:
http://www.mindbodygreen.com/0-9930/debunking-the-myths-about-vegans-protein.html
this:
http://www.pcrm.org/health/diets/vsk/vegetarian-starter-kit-protein
and this (for athletes):
http://www.nomeatathlete.com/vegetarian-protein-primer/

If you're on a plant-based diet, there are two things to pay attention to: vitamin B12 and omega-3 fatty acids. You can get the former from enriched soymilk (I'm a runner, and I drink Silk chocolate soymilk after each run) and the latter from flax seed (I add two teaspoons to my oatmeal in the morning).

There is a really good book that explains all the dietary issues in detail:
http://www.amazon.com/Becoming-Vegan-Complete-Adopting-Plant-Based/dp/1570671036

I haven't wanted to bother, but she did it while visiting us recently and then made tiramisu with it. You would swear it was regular tiramisu, but it was completely dairy free.

I have a tall stack of vegan cookbooks with recipes just waiting for me to try them. I so agree with you: once your taste buds get over the grease, they begin to awaken to all the wonderful flavors of plant foods.

And--we eat until we are stuffed and don't gain weight!