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Israel/Palestine
Related: About this forumU.N. says Israeli move on Palestinian permits may be collective punishment
Source: Reuters
World | Fri Jun 10, 2016 9:35am EDT
U.N. says Israeli move on Palestinian permits may be collective punishment
GENEVA | BY STEPHANIE NEBEHAY
Israel's cancellation of entry permits for Palestinians following a deadly attack in Tel Aviv may amount to collective punishment, which is banned under international law, the United Nations' top human rights official said on Friday.
Responding to the criticism, Israel defended its actions as "legitimate steps in order to defend its citizens from terrorists".
The Israeli military on Thursday revoked permits for 83,000 Palestinians to visit Israel and said it would send hundreds more troops to the occupied West Bank a day after a Palestinian gun attack that killed four Israelis in Tel Aviv.
U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights Zeid Ra'ad Al Hussein condemned the attack, the largest loss of Israeli life in a single attack since the current surge in violence, spokeswoman Ravina Shamdasani said.
But he is deeply concerned about the revoking of permits "which may amount to prohibited collective punishment and will only increase the sense of injustice and frustration felt by Palestinians in this very tense time", she told a news briefing.
[font size=1]-snip-[/font]
U.N. says Israeli move on Palestinian permits may be collective punishment
GENEVA | BY STEPHANIE NEBEHAY
Israel's cancellation of entry permits for Palestinians following a deadly attack in Tel Aviv may amount to collective punishment, which is banned under international law, the United Nations' top human rights official said on Friday.
Responding to the criticism, Israel defended its actions as "legitimate steps in order to defend its citizens from terrorists".
The Israeli military on Thursday revoked permits for 83,000 Palestinians to visit Israel and said it would send hundreds more troops to the occupied West Bank a day after a Palestinian gun attack that killed four Israelis in Tel Aviv.
U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights Zeid Ra'ad Al Hussein condemned the attack, the largest loss of Israeli life in a single attack since the current surge in violence, spokeswoman Ravina Shamdasani said.
But he is deeply concerned about the revoking of permits "which may amount to prohibited collective punishment and will only increase the sense of injustice and frustration felt by Palestinians in this very tense time", she told a news briefing.
[font size=1]-snip-[/font]
Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-shooting-un-idUSKCN0YW0Y5
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U.N. says Israeli move on Palestinian permits may be collective punishment (Original Post)
Eugene
Jun 2016
OP
France: Israel's Suspension of Palestinians' Entry Permits Could Escalate Violence
Little Tich
Jun 2016
#8
shira
(30,109 posts)1. UN = Useless Nations, bastardizing the meaning of collective punishment. n/t
6chars
(3,967 posts)2. UN says Hamas is the real victim here.
shira
(30,109 posts)5. Of course Hamas is the victim. When's the last time the UN condemned Hamas....
...for anything? In a resolution...
Ever?
I doubt it. Hamas can do no wrong against the Jooooz.
Response to Eugene (Original post)
Mosby This message was self-deleted by its author.
shira
(30,109 posts)4. Yep, Israel can do nothing to defend its citizens....
It's either collective punishment or disproportionate response, war crimes....
shira
(30,109 posts)6. An oldie, but goody.... From 2 years ago (that's like FOREVER)...
Israel's critics don't want a proportionate response in Gaza. They want no response at all
Over the past couple of days, as the debate over Israels military intervention in Gaza has raged, Ive noticed the same phrase being repeated. Its basically a variation on the following: Yes, Israel has a right to defend itself. But the response must be proportionate. And what were seeing is anything but proportionate. Nick Clegg has joined this chorus, accusing Israel of imposing a "disproportionate form of collective punishment" on the Palestinian people. His words were echoed on Monday by the United Nations Relief and Works agency, which warned that Maximum restraint must be exercised and measures of distinction, proportionality and precaution must be respected. During Mondays House of Commons debate, a succession of MPs rose to make a similar point.
And who can argue with it? Who would want to see a disproportionate response to a crisis such as this? But if we are calling for proportionality from Israel, then Id like to ask a question: what would a proportionate response actually look like? If everyone accepts the principle of Israel defending itself, how should that defence operate in practice? One way Israel is able to defend itself from the ongoing Hamas missile strikes is, of course, to send in ground troops to locate and destroy them and the terrorists who operate them. But as weve seen, according to Israels critics, this represents a terrible escalation of the conflict. An alternative is air strikes. But again, Israeli air strikes have resulted in global condemnation. Cruise missile strikes are also an option. But I cant quite imagine the Stop the War coalition issuing a press release welcoming Israels use of precision munitions in central Gaza. What about a more surgical approach? Perhaps Israel could send in assassination teams to target the Hamas leadership and other key operatives? Today the UN secretary general Ban Ki-moon welcomed the news that Israeli hit squads had been deployed to the Palestinian territories. 'This represents a timely de-escalation of the conflict,' he said.
What about no offensive action at all? What if Israel simply attempts to contain Hamas within Gaza? No, sorry, that wont work, because then Israel will be accused of turning Gaza into the worlds largest prison camp. A blockade of Hamas? No, the world is demanding that the blockade be lifted. Targeted sanctions on the Palestinian authority? Are you being serious? That will just penalise innocent Palestinians. And anyway, the world should be standing in solidarity with them in their hour of need. When people say Israels response to Hamas aggression must be proportionate, they dont mean it. What they actually mean is that Israel shouldnt respond at all. Which is fine: everyones entitled to their view. But Israels critics should at least be honest about what theyre really proposing. And what theyre proposing is that while Israel has a right to defend itself in principle, it shouldnt do so in practice. It should just turn the other cheek.
Which is why Id like to ask those who claim that Israels response is disproportionate another question. What do you think the death toll would be if Hamas had Israels military capability including its nuclear capability? Because I think in those circumstances we would see with horrifying clarity what a disproportionate use of military force really looks like. I appreciate that many if not a majority of those criticising Israel do so from positions of morality, rather than ideology. But it is not enough to simply scream about what Israel shouldnt be doing. As the rockets continue to rain down, people also need to explain precisely what they think Israel is entitled to do to protect itself.
more
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100281103/israels-critics-dont-want-a-proportionate-response-in-gaza-they-want-no-response-at-all/
Over the past couple of days, as the debate over Israels military intervention in Gaza has raged, Ive noticed the same phrase being repeated. Its basically a variation on the following: Yes, Israel has a right to defend itself. But the response must be proportionate. And what were seeing is anything but proportionate. Nick Clegg has joined this chorus, accusing Israel of imposing a "disproportionate form of collective punishment" on the Palestinian people. His words were echoed on Monday by the United Nations Relief and Works agency, which warned that Maximum restraint must be exercised and measures of distinction, proportionality and precaution must be respected. During Mondays House of Commons debate, a succession of MPs rose to make a similar point.
And who can argue with it? Who would want to see a disproportionate response to a crisis such as this? But if we are calling for proportionality from Israel, then Id like to ask a question: what would a proportionate response actually look like? If everyone accepts the principle of Israel defending itself, how should that defence operate in practice? One way Israel is able to defend itself from the ongoing Hamas missile strikes is, of course, to send in ground troops to locate and destroy them and the terrorists who operate them. But as weve seen, according to Israels critics, this represents a terrible escalation of the conflict. An alternative is air strikes. But again, Israeli air strikes have resulted in global condemnation. Cruise missile strikes are also an option. But I cant quite imagine the Stop the War coalition issuing a press release welcoming Israels use of precision munitions in central Gaza. What about a more surgical approach? Perhaps Israel could send in assassination teams to target the Hamas leadership and other key operatives? Today the UN secretary general Ban Ki-moon welcomed the news that Israeli hit squads had been deployed to the Palestinian territories. 'This represents a timely de-escalation of the conflict,' he said.
What about no offensive action at all? What if Israel simply attempts to contain Hamas within Gaza? No, sorry, that wont work, because then Israel will be accused of turning Gaza into the worlds largest prison camp. A blockade of Hamas? No, the world is demanding that the blockade be lifted. Targeted sanctions on the Palestinian authority? Are you being serious? That will just penalise innocent Palestinians. And anyway, the world should be standing in solidarity with them in their hour of need. When people say Israels response to Hamas aggression must be proportionate, they dont mean it. What they actually mean is that Israel shouldnt respond at all. Which is fine: everyones entitled to their view. But Israels critics should at least be honest about what theyre really proposing. And what theyre proposing is that while Israel has a right to defend itself in principle, it shouldnt do so in practice. It should just turn the other cheek.
Which is why Id like to ask those who claim that Israels response is disproportionate another question. What do you think the death toll would be if Hamas had Israels military capability including its nuclear capability? Because I think in those circumstances we would see with horrifying clarity what a disproportionate use of military force really looks like. I appreciate that many if not a majority of those criticising Israel do so from positions of morality, rather than ideology. But it is not enough to simply scream about what Israel shouldnt be doing. As the rockets continue to rain down, people also need to explain precisely what they think Israel is entitled to do to protect itself.
more
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100281103/israels-critics-dont-want-a-proportionate-response-in-gaza-they-want-no-response-at-all/
shira
(30,109 posts)7. The rest of this great article...
.....Withdraw from Gaza is one frequently proffered solution. But Israel did withdraw from Gaza. They withdrew, demolished the settlements and forcibly evicted almost 10,000 Jewish settlers. Then Hamas moved in, started firing rockets and launching terrorist attacks.
They should introduce an immediate ceasefire is another demand. Israel did. And the rockets kept on coming.
They should sit down and talk, like we did with the IRA in Northern Ireland. Yes, we did sit down and talk. But before we sat down we asked the IRA to stop blowing things up first. And they agreed.
Lets say for the sake of argument that Benjamin Netanyahu suddenly has an epiphany. My God, he says to himself, our critics are right. Our response is disproportionate. So he goes on TV, and tells the Israeli people: I have told our armed forces to disengage. The rockets will keep exploding. The kidnappings will keep happening. The suicide attacks will keep coming. But we will not lift a finger in response.
How long do Israels critics think Netanyahu would remain Prime Minister of Israel in those circumstances? A week? An hour?
Like it or not, Israel is a sovereign, democratic state. Not only does it have the right to defend itself, its people expect it to defend itself. And when youre sitting huddled in a bomb shelter, and then emerge to see the charred remnants of a Qassam rocket sticking out of the roof of your childs school, I suspect it shapes your perception of what a proportionate response actually is.
So what is it that we want? Do we want the troops, the bombs, the cruise missiles, the drones, the artillery, the death squads, the blockades or the sanctions? Because if we say Israel has a right to defend itself, and mean it then, then were going to have stop handwringing and start choosing. And if we dont, then were going to have to be honest and admit we dont want Israel to defend itself at all.
They should introduce an immediate ceasefire is another demand. Israel did. And the rockets kept on coming.
They should sit down and talk, like we did with the IRA in Northern Ireland. Yes, we did sit down and talk. But before we sat down we asked the IRA to stop blowing things up first. And they agreed.
Lets say for the sake of argument that Benjamin Netanyahu suddenly has an epiphany. My God, he says to himself, our critics are right. Our response is disproportionate. So he goes on TV, and tells the Israeli people: I have told our armed forces to disengage. The rockets will keep exploding. The kidnappings will keep happening. The suicide attacks will keep coming. But we will not lift a finger in response.
How long do Israels critics think Netanyahu would remain Prime Minister of Israel in those circumstances? A week? An hour?
Like it or not, Israel is a sovereign, democratic state. Not only does it have the right to defend itself, its people expect it to defend itself. And when youre sitting huddled in a bomb shelter, and then emerge to see the charred remnants of a Qassam rocket sticking out of the roof of your childs school, I suspect it shapes your perception of what a proportionate response actually is.
So what is it that we want? Do we want the troops, the bombs, the cruise missiles, the drones, the artillery, the death squads, the blockades or the sanctions? Because if we say Israel has a right to defend itself, and mean it then, then were going to have stop handwringing and start choosing. And if we dont, then were going to have to be honest and admit we dont want Israel to defend itself at all.
Little Tich
(6,171 posts)8. France: Israel's Suspension of Palestinians' Entry Permits Could Escalate Violence
Source: Times of Israel
French foreign minister reiterates France's condemnation of the Tel Aviv terror attack, but was critical of Israel's response.
AP - France's foreign minister warned Friday that Israel's ban on Palestinians entering its territory following the "abominable" attack on a popular cafe in Tel Aviv could escalate violence instead of focus attention on the need to pursue peace.
Jean-Marc Ayrault reiterated France's condemnation of the attack, which killed four civilians, but was critical of Israel's response.
Israel imposed travel restrictions Thursday on Palestinians and sent hundreds of additional troops into the West Bank. On Friday, the military announced it was closing the West Bank until the end of the Jewish holiday of Shavuot on Sunday due to security concerns, except for "humanitarian and medical" cases and for Palestinians to worship at al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem.
"The decision by the Israeli authorities today to revoke tens of thousands of entry permits could stoke tensions which could lead to a risk of escalation," Ayrault told a small group of reporters. "We must be careful about anything that could stoke tensions."
AP - France's foreign minister warned Friday that Israel's ban on Palestinians entering its territory following the "abominable" attack on a popular cafe in Tel Aviv could escalate violence instead of focus attention on the need to pursue peace.
Jean-Marc Ayrault reiterated France's condemnation of the attack, which killed four civilians, but was critical of Israel's response.
Israel imposed travel restrictions Thursday on Palestinians and sent hundreds of additional troops into the West Bank. On Friday, the military announced it was closing the West Bank until the end of the Jewish holiday of Shavuot on Sunday due to security concerns, except for "humanitarian and medical" cases and for Palestinians to worship at al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem.
"The decision by the Israeli authorities today to revoke tens of thousands of entry permits could stoke tensions which could lead to a risk of escalation," Ayrault told a small group of reporters. "We must be careful about anything that could stoke tensions."
Read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.724363
6chars
(3,967 posts)9. Charlie hebdo escalated tensions too
Where is the criticism Of france?