Israel/Palestine
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This message was self-deleted by its author (Little Tich) on Mon Mar 20, 2017, 10:40 AM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.
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shira
(30,109 posts)All the terror and PA incitement, encouragement & rewarding of terror is certainly an impediment to peace, in addition to Abbas' gloating to never recognize the Jewish state. And then there's this year's push to overturn the Balfour Declaration, which proves Abbas and the PA don't want 2 states. Of course there's the refusal to drop the right-of-return of 5 million refugees into Israel....
Meanwhile, the areas of the settlement blocs today are no different than in the mid 1990's. They've been built-up but haven't expanded beyond the blocs. So settlements? Come on.
I fail to see how shifting all the blame onto Israel will get the PA to ever accept 2 states and call off the war. All this does is embolden them to keep rejecting every offer. In fact, the PA rejected Kerry's 2014 framework while Netanyahu accepted. So WTF? It was Netanyahu back in 2009-10 who halted settlement building while Abbas did nothing in return until a half-hearted motion at the last minute. So again, WTF?
Response to shira (Reply #1)
Little Tich This message was self-deleted by its author.
shira
(30,109 posts)That's asinine. He even said Abbas is non-violent, which is worse.
No one is saying settlements aren't an obstacle, but they're not even the main obstacle given what I wrote above.
Response to shira (Reply #3)
Little Tich This message was self-deleted by its author.
shira
(30,109 posts)Abbas waited it out until the last month when he half-heartedly pretended to be interested in negotiations.
HRC commented on this...
Now, would it have been a perfectly acceptable outcome for every Israeli and every Palestinian? No. No compromise ever is. But there were moments of opportunity. And I will also say this. When Prime Minister Netanyahu agreed to a 10-month settlement freeze I flew to Jerusalem. We’d been working on this. George Mitchell had been taking the lead on it. And when Prime Minister Netanyahu agreed to a 10-month settlement freeze, it wasn’t perfect. It didn’t cover East Jerusalem, but it covered much of the contested area in the West Bank.
And I stood on a stage with him at 11 o’clock – Israelis always meet late at night, I don’t understand it – (laughter) – but 11 o’clock at night, midnight, and I said it was unprecedented for any Israeli prime minister to have done that. I got so criticized. I got criticized from the right, the left, the center, Israeli, Jewish, Arab, Christian, you name it. Everybody criticized me. But the fact was it was a 10-month settlement freeze. And he was good to his word. And we couldn’t get the Palestinians into the conversation until the tenth month.
http://www.state.gov/secretary/20092013clinton/rm/2012/11/201343.htm
Response to shira (Reply #5)
Little Tich This message was self-deleted by its author.
shira
(30,109 posts)Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)And it's enough THAT they recognize it. They don't have to recognize it using the exact words Netanyahu insists on. Recognizing the state is the same thing.
shira
(30,109 posts)....which recognized the right of a Jewish homeland to exist. It's obvious the PLO lied. The very fact they insist on a fake right of return means they don't believe the Jews have a right to self-determination and sovereignty in their own homeland. They still praise and reward generously terrorist attacks on innocent Jews.
It's not enough.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)ideologies like Randian capitalism and Communism.
Apartheid, a single bi-national state, and genocide are the three options at this point.
shira
(30,109 posts)oberliner
(58,724 posts)It is literally the exact same rhetoric that one hears from the far right among both Israelis and Palestinians.
To quote Samantha Power at the UN:
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)They can't be rescued by others.
shira
(30,109 posts)Israel has agreed or offered the Palestinians their own state many times over the past 80 years. They made peace with Egypt and Jordan and removed settlements several times in the past.
Enough with the pretense that Israel is the reason there's no peaceful 2 state solution.