Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Mosby

(17,452 posts)
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 10:47 AM Feb 2024

No Palestinian state, yes common sense and self-defense

In recent days, high-ranking leaders of both the United States and the United Kingdom have reportedly been considering recognizing a Palestinian state. Israel’s cabinet, followed by a full Knesset vote, rejected what they called, “International diktats,” and “reward to terrorism.” Polling indicates that the Israeli public overwhelmingly opposes a Palestinian state.

No people or nation “deserves,” or has a “right” to statehood. Statehood is earned. There are over 3,000 estimated, stateless nations and only approximately 200 states. Many, such as the Tamils, Pashtuns, Kurds, Uigurs, Oromo, Yoruba, and Igbo, are more peaceful, larger, have a longer history, a stronger economy, and more durable, sustainable cultural institutions. Statehood is earned by military, economic, and diplomatic power. It is maintained by civic institutions, a unified citizenry, a coherent culture, and many other aspects of united peoplehood. The Palestinians are among the least deserving of a state.

Palestinians have a history of terrorism, locally and internationally. They continue to practice, celebrate, and brag about their terror and war crimes let alone renounce them. Palestinians have brought the world airplane and cruise ship hijackings, suicide bombings, stabbing attacks, car-ramming attacks, political assignations, indiscriminate bombing of civilians, rape, mutilation, and all manner of atrocities against Israel, and the world at large. Any leader of Israel, the US, or the UK has a responsibility to protect their citizens. Any support of the Palestinian culture of hate and violence is an abdication of this basic responsibility of leadership. Statehood would provide numerous opportunities to support violence directed at others and Palestinians themselves. It would protect corrupt, totalitarian leaders.

https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/no-palestinian-state-yes-common-sense-and-self-defense/

This is an increasingly common view of the notion of Palestinian statehood. Most of the media doesn't want to talk about it, and likes to aver that it's an opinion of the hard right. It's not.

10 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
No Palestinian state, yes common sense and self-defense (Original Post) Mosby Feb 2024 OP
So permanent occupation oppression and cycles Voltaire2 Feb 2024 #1
So what would be the best way to deal with Palestine? Serious question Walleye Feb 2024 #2
One possible idea that might work Mosby Feb 2024 #5
Something about when they learn to love their children as much a they hate Jews? Walleye Feb 2024 #8
Being a Democrat I know you are capable of empathy BeyondGeography Feb 2024 #3
I cannot recommend your response post more fully. hlthe2b Feb 2024 #4
I'm with Goddessartist Feb 2024 #10
Netanyahu would not have remained in power LuvLoogie Feb 2024 #6
Israel does not have direct elections Mosby Feb 2024 #9
Earned enid602 Feb 2024 #7

Voltaire2

(14,700 posts)
1. So permanent occupation oppression and cycles
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 10:50 AM
Feb 2024

of violence, or resolution by genocide.

Seems like a reasonable plan.

Mosby

(17,452 posts)
5. One possible idea that might work
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 12:32 PM
Feb 2024

Is creating a protectorate in the WB and Gaza, administered by Jordan and Egypt respectively. It's not very likely, but probably more realistic than just giving a country to the Palestinians or ending the occupation.

This conflict should not have been allowed to continue for all these years, something should have been done decades ago to address Jewish and Palestinian rights in the region. There are no good solutions now, given that the Palestinians refuse to do the hard work towards statehood and the rest of the regions "leaders" only care about hurting Israel, the US and western culture.

Walleye

(35,658 posts)
8. Something about when they learn to love their children as much a they hate Jews?
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 12:49 PM
Feb 2024

I think your suggestion is very good, this whole thing is been going on for my whole lifetime seemingly with no progress made. I remember when they were on the brink of reaching agreement and Arafat pulled out.
I like the idea of Jordan and Egypt Administering a protectorate. If they would be willing.

BeyondGeography

(40,013 posts)
3. Being a Democrat I know you are capable of empathy
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 10:59 AM
Feb 2024

Put yourself in the shoes of an average Palestinian and ask how you’d feel reading that.

hlthe2b

(106,329 posts)
4. I cannot recommend your response post more fully.
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 11:11 AM
Feb 2024

How can anyone support this? Even if only self-preservation were at play, there would never be peace with this stance. Something we learned after WWII, culminating in the Marshall Plan. How?

LuvLoogie

(7,542 posts)
6. Netanyahu would not have remained in power
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 12:41 PM
Feb 2024

all these decades without support from the majority of Israelis. They are on board with how the Palestinians have been treated, the annexation of the West Bank, the throttling of Gaza.

They are planning 3300 new settlements in the West Bank.

Netanyahu will not step down. He will stay the PM, and nobody will replace him. The "Right" in Israel will grow stronger. And they will kill more Palestinians until they abandoned their homeland.

Mosby

(17,452 posts)
9. Israel does not have direct elections
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 01:29 PM
Feb 2024

They use a parliamentary system where voters vote for parties and the winning party then has to put together a coalition that represents at least 51% of the Knesset (Israeli congress). It's a poor system imo, that I have been quite critical of. Netanyahus party, Likud has never received much more than 33% of the vote, but they have been able to cobble together coalitions with the religious parties and the settler/nationalistic parties.

A lot of pundits believe he will be gone after the war, along with others in the IDF and security agencies, for their utter failure to provide Israel the security needed on Oct 7th. Right now its Benny Gantz (center left) not Bibi, who is running the war cabinet.

Secondly, Israel has not annexed the WB or Gaza.

Israel has faced almost 100 years of terrorism from the Arabs, is it any wonder that they feel the way they do with regards to security?


enid602

(9,039 posts)
7. Earned
Sat Feb 24, 2024, 12:47 PM
Feb 2024

“No people or nation “deserves,” or has a “right” to statehood. Statehood is earned.” A former generation of Jews earned Israel. Today, Palestine is experiencing its share of the same style of misery.

Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Israel/Palestine»No Palestinian state, yes...