Civil Liberties
Related: About this forum@CustomsBorder got on a Greyhound bus yesterday and asked every passenger for their papers
What country is this?
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.@CustomsBorder got on a Greyhound bus yesterday at 4:30pm in Fort Lauderdale and asked every passenger for their papers and to prove citizenship. Proof of citizenship is NOT required to ride a bus! For more information about your rights, call our hotline👉 1-888-600-5762
9:44 AM - 20 Jan 2018
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Redacción MundoHispánico
Posted 5 horas ago
Un video grabado por un pasajero de un autobús Greyhound muestra a un agente de Aduanas y Protección de Fronteras de EE.UU (CBP) pidiendo documentos a una mujer para probar si tenía estatus legal en el país.
El video fue publicado por la organización activista Coalición de Inmigrantes de Florida, que informó a su vez que la parada ocurrió el viernes a las 4:30 de la tarde, hora local, en Fort Lauderdale.
JDC
(10,494 posts)Girard442
(6,413 posts)If you're going to do it, say it right.
GreenPartyVoter
(73,069 posts)paleotn
(19,298 posts)sinkingfeeling
(53,060 posts)a driver's license and Social Security card, but neither proves citizenship as both can be faked.
Ilsa
(62,251 posts)Toting around birth certificates is ridiculous.
Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)Ilsa
(62,251 posts)AJT
(5,240 posts)how would you be able to prove citizenship?
Irish_Dem
(58,324 posts)I think I will get on a bus with my Irish passport and when asked to show my papers, will tell them to F off and call the Irish Embassy.
Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)procon
(15,805 posts)They recently tried this and now have a class action lawsuit for violating constitution rights. Lessons learned? None. Nada. Zilch. Zip.
"The Department of Homeland Security is facing a class action lawsuit over an incident in which all the passengers on a domestic flight were held and searched by US Customs and Border Protection (CBP) agents before being allowed to get off their plane potentially in violation of the US constitution."
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/oct/12/lawsuit-claims-border-patrol-violated-constitution-by-searching-delta-plane
DFW
(56,680 posts)In Trump's America, confronting an armed cop with nothing but the law on your side can have fatal consequences. You could end up dead right.
TreasonousBastard
(43,049 posts)Marthe48
(19,114 posts)Nazi bastards. Are we still wearing safety pins? I have one on my purse and one on each jacket.
Binkie The Clown
(7,911 posts)citizen blues
(588 posts)Didnt see any of the white people asked for ID.
deancr
(151 posts)is not America.
TNNurse
(7,130 posts)What the hell was border patrol doing there??
I really miss democracy.
humbled_opinion
(4,423 posts)bucolic_frolic
(47,137 posts)it's been with several different banks because they kept merging
they said the government requires us to keep up to date information. okay
they asked if I was a citizen. yes.
Do i have foreign bank accounts. No.
They asked my income and source.
As if the government doesn't have all that info? I file a tax return, I have a passport.
They learned nothing new for their phishing expedition.
Sounds to me like they are crosschecking databases, and requiring banks to provide
one set of info.
Bernardo de La Paz
(51,024 posts)Those discriminatory profiling jackass are profiling poor people.
Equal even-handed enforcement of the law would see them demanding papers from first-class airline passengers too.
MarcA
(2,195 posts)aggiesal
(9,481 posts)1) Birth Certificate only proves you're born here. But doesn't stop you from relinquishing your citizenship and become a citizen of a different country. So Birth Certificate is not a document that proves citizenship.
2) Social Security Card only proves you're working here legally if it's real or illegal if you can make a faked SS card. Again SS Card is not a document that proves citizenship.
3) Drivers License is issued state by state. No possible way this could be a citizenship document.
4) Passport is probably the closest anyone could get to verify citizenship, but the State Department can issue a passport to non-US citizens at its discretion. Besides, it is not mandatory that we all get a passport. In fact, I used to have one, but it expired in 2001 and I've gone without one ever since. Passport does not prove citizenship.
So, what document does everyone have that can be considered proof of citizenship?
I don't know of any.
GreenEyedLefty
(2,102 posts)to issue a passport.
A Driver License shows identity and residence. A birth certificate proves citizenship - place and time of birth.
aggiesal
(9,481 posts)It does mean the person is entitled to citizenship but
it doesn't stop you from relinquishing your U.S. citizenship
and become a citizen of a different country.
So Birth Certificate is not a document that proves citizenship.
I could move to Canada, relinquish my US citizenship and
become a citizen of Canada.
How would my birth certificate prove I'm a US citizen?
GreenEyedLefty
(2,102 posts)According to the Constitution you just need to be born here or naturalized to be a citizen. Just going off of experience of the minimum requirements to obtain a United States passport.
I am not an expert on immigration or Canadian law but it seems if you are going to relinquish your citizenship you probably have to meet some minimal requirements to prove that you were a citizen of somewhere else. The minimum standard is the birth certificate.
I can see this going circular so I'm going to leave it here.
aggiesal
(9,481 posts)My point is that if, for example, you are a Canadian citizen, but was
born in the U.S. and not a U.S. citizen, when BP comes asking for your
papers, you can probably get away with showing your U.S. birth certificate,
but it's not a document of citizenship, since you would be a Canadian citizen.
Basically, just because you have a U.S. birth certificate, doesn't mean you
are a U.S. Citizen. It just means you have the ability to be a U.S. Citizen if
you choose to.
BigOleDummy
(2,274 posts)....... Actually this is not really new. Back in the mid 80's I got on a Greyhound in Eagle Pass ,Texas. Border patrol/Customs , whoever I really don't remember the agency, got on after we loaded and checked everyone's papers. Except mine. I'm a white male. The uniformed agent got to me and said, "I guess you're American, huh?", turned around and left the bus. True story.
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)I remember seeing that in old movies about WWII...when the SS and other bad guys would stop people on the street w/o cause and ask to see their "papers." I remember thinking...wow, how awful. What an awful, tyrannical place. I'm so glad I live in a democracy, where copy can't stop you to see some sort of papers, which you have to show, or you'll be arrested.
RKP5637
(67,112 posts)spike jones
(1,779 posts)I never show it to them unless I am actually driving. I tell them my name and answer other questions honestly if they are not intrusive. They always want to see some identifying papers and I always say no, not in America. I guess I should add, "Not yet."
Timmygoat
(779 posts)When my husband was stationed in Europe. We crossed over to East Germany (after getting travel orders from the US) before the wall came down and this reminds me of what happened to us It also happened to us in slovakia, the only thing missing here seems
to be the very large mirror the border guards had mounted on wheels, this was used to roll under the bus to make sure no-one was
escaping by holding on to the bottom of the bus.
LW1977
(1,397 posts)Nazi Arschlochs!
Stonepounder
(4,033 posts)Steven Levitsky and Daniel Ziblatt
Levitsky and Ziblatt show how democracies have collapsed elsewherenot just through violent coups, but more commonly (and insidiously) through a gradual slide into authoritarianism.... How Democracies Die is a lucid and essential guide to what can happen here.
New York Times
How Democracies Die studies the modern history of apparently healthy democracies that have slid into autocracy. It is hard to read this fine book without coming away terribly concerned about the possibility Trump might inflict a mortal wound on the health of the republic.... It is simplistic to expect boots marching in the streets, but there will be a battle for democracy.
Jonathan Chait, New York Magazine
"Well worth the read."
--Stonepounder
lastlib
(24,949 posts)Nazi Amerikkka, I guess.
samnsara
(18,290 posts)paleotn
(19,298 posts)There. That's better.
NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)This is truly frightening. Unfortunately, not surprising.
PatSeg
(49,740 posts)For every incident like this that we hear about, how many others are there? I cringe watching movies about Nazi Germany where they demand people's papers. Now it is happening here for real.
Irish_Dem
(58,324 posts)"Carrying papers" with you at all time sounds like Nazi Germany.