For him, and folks like him, the end result is all that matters. Even if it means lying, misleading, and cheating.

Like we have always said.

Start getting the crow ready, and I'll wash up a bunch of plates and set the table for the ammophobes.

Those, are the VPC's numbers...

They are offensive weapons. You can't stop a bullet with a bullet.

Last edited Sun Jul 10, 2016, 09:39 AM - Edit history (1)

When they do, they don't always get off the first shot.

I did find a table that showed that .08% of violent crime was averted by DGU while 43.8% were resolved by offering no resistance, 22.1% were resolved by threatening without a weapon and 22.2% were resolved by non-confrontation methods.

So, from your own posted source 88.1% were resolved without a gun or to be more blunt 1100 times more people resolved a violent confrontation without a gun than with one.

Lie much?

Even with massive DGU understatement from DGU, it's quite clear that guns save lives.

So they can pretty much "overlook" anything that doesn't make them feel all warm and fuzzy or match the bumper stickers they draw their "philosophy" from.

If defensive gun uses saved 100
lives a year, but caused 900,000 (or almost a million) 'criminal homicides,' you would consider that 'justified'?

If it's found to be murder or manslaughter, it's by definition not defensive.

Insert the word "guns" in my post between the words "but" and "caused": so question is whether poster is actually saying that he/she would trade 100 lives saved by defensive gun uses for 900,000 gun-related criminal homicides.
Secondary question: does it mean anything if some of those 900,000 were the children of Newtown, Conn?

a person would be better off owning a gun.

Even the decidedly antigun VPC concedes this

who escape an otherwise justified conviction?

How many more criminals could we get off the street if only we just abolish the 4th Amendment?

Would it be worth the occasional innocent person being enduing warrantless search and seizure?

You don't care to answer my direct question.

Let's just put each other on Ignore and move on.
Good bye.

And those rights should not be disposed of in the name of security.

That most defensive gun uses don't involve actual gun violence.

...any incident involving a gun that doesn't result in a death, means that the gun wasn't used. Or at least what I infer from many pro-control comments.

*snort*

The odds that a gun owner will someday have to kill in self defense is incredibly slim.

Just to be certain I have enough...

va mtn man: I stumbled over a recent article that made this graph, using the Violence Policy Center's numbers (which have the smallest number of defensive gun uses than most other studies) You know run by the same Josh Sugarman that likes to make up new terms, specifically to cause confusion...

There appear to be approx 8 times more dgus (defensive gun uses) than murders (presumably gun murders), for one particular unidentified year. What was the year, mtn man?
Since you didn't bother to make any point, but from further progun discourse downthread, it seems you all are thinking that this somehow justifies guns as saving more lives than they cause(??correct me if wrong).

Disabuse yourselves from that absurd thought, for, for that to be true, all of those approx 68,000 dgus would have to have saved a life. That is an impossibility. You're lucky to get away with a couple hundred lives saved due to dgus, in that graph, maybe 10 times higher, or more.
Then you would also need tack on approx 800 firearm accidental deaths for a more valid contrast, as well as make a separate graph which would include gun suicides.
What was the total figure for violent crimes committed with firearms for that year mtn man? & firearms used in property crimes for that year mtn man? Imagine the blue 'murder' bar going about 3 or 4 times higher than the dgu bar.

Your second amendment mythology is so stupid sometimes, yet it is almost always astonishing to see how much support downthread the mythology seems to get.

Fix your link, sloppy mtn man, it is to justifiable homicides vs. non fatal dgus.

SCantiGOP & struggle for progress posters were on the right track, exposing mtn man & his back slapping psycho-fants for their misconceptions.