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guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
Fri Jan 25, 2019, 07:28 PM Jan 2019

Provoked By Trump, The Religious Left Is Finding Its Voice

From the article:

Religious conservatives have rarely faced much competition in the political realm from faith-based groups on the left.
The provocations of President Trump may finally be changing that.
Nearly 40 years after some prominent evangelical Christians organized a Moral Majority movement to promote a conservative political agenda, a comparable effort by liberal religious leaders is coalescing in support of immigrant rights, universal health care, LGBTQ rights and racial justice.


To read more:

https://www.npr.org/2019/01/24/684435743/provoked-by-trump-the-religious-left-is-finding-its-voice
28 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Provoked By Trump, The Religious Left Is Finding Its Voice (Original Post) guillaumeb Jan 2019 OP
Since you neglected to name or link to this group, I will: MineralMan Jan 2019 #1
It was in the next paragraph, guillaumeb Jan 2019 #2
Not everyone cares to click links. MineralMan Jan 2019 #3
I prefer to encourage exploration. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #4
Who? Major Nikon Jan 2019 #5
Neither had I heard of them. MineralMan Jan 2019 #6
Typically the links lead to appalling Voltaire2 Jan 2019 #7
That's true. This group is waffling on reproductive choice, MineralMan Jan 2019 #9
It's worse than that, they have no clue Voltaire2 Jan 2019 #11
The Right has the 24/7 Fox media outlet; that dwarfs any left output Bretton Garcia Jan 2019 #26
It's good to have a counterweight to the religious right marylandblue Jan 2019 #8
And it broadens the dialogue. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #10
Read the article. Voltaire2 Jan 2019 #12
I read it, mass is small but non-zero marylandblue Jan 2019 #13
Zero. Voltaire2 Jan 2019 #14
So your entire objection is just that this group only organizes protests marylandblue Jan 2019 #15
The "concern" about effectiveness was spelled out clearly Voltaire2 Jan 2019 #16
We just need more gun nuts to keep us safe from the gun nuts Major Nikon Jan 2019 #17
People are irrational marylandblue Jan 2019 #19
You have this exactly backwards Major Nikon Jan 2019 #20
Not really looking to reach the unreachable marylandblue Jan 2019 #21
They aren't going to reach the reachable either Major Nikon Jan 2019 #22
If not this group, then there are others I heard of marylandblue Jan 2019 #23
I have no doubt it's being felt in churches Major Nikon Jan 2019 #24
Yes, I think having a religious leftism is beneficial marylandblue Jan 2019 #18
The "religious left" is often overlooked Igel Jan 2019 #25
Newsflash: Act_of_Reparation Jan 2019 #27
Shh, that doesn't fit the preferred narrative. trotsky Jan 2019 #28

MineralMan

(147,334 posts)
3. Not everyone cares to click links.
Fri Jan 25, 2019, 07:42 PM
Jan 2019

Why not simply include the name of the group and a link in your post, as a service to DUers?

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
4. I prefer to encourage exploration.
Fri Jan 25, 2019, 07:44 PM
Jan 2019

But yes, some prefer to look briefly.

Again, thank you for the link and the suggestion.

Major Nikon

(36,899 posts)
5. Who?
Fri Jan 25, 2019, 10:25 PM
Jan 2019

Never heard of them. I doubt very many random people on the street have ever heard of them either.

I get that there are groups out there doing this sort of thing, but they aren't what I would call "a comparable effort" to several wingnut groups, and there's no reason to suspect they ever will be.

MineralMan

(147,334 posts)
6. Neither had I heard of them.
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 09:43 AM
Jan 2019

I was just naming and linking to them because guillaumeb neglected to do so in his post. I was trying to save other DUers the time needed to visit the NPR site to find out what he was talking about.

I find posts that include such information to be more useful than posts that require an additional click-through to get actual useful info.

Voltaire2

(14,632 posts)
7. Typically the links lead to appalling
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 10:45 AM
Jan 2019

nonsense or a complete contradiction of whatever point was trying to be made.

In this case you have to get to the last few paragraphs to understand that the “religious left” isn’t even in the game.

MineralMan

(147,334 posts)
9. That's true. This group is waffling on reproductive choice,
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 11:19 AM
Jan 2019

we learn near the end of the story. But then, some who claim to be on the left sometimes are ambivalent about reproductive choice, aren't they?

Perhaps the OP would have done better to link directly to the group's website...

Voltaire2

(14,632 posts)
11. It's worse than that, they have no clue
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 12:25 PM
Jan 2019

how to compete with the religious right as a political force. They aren’t even in the game. They aren’t organizing voters and putting pressure on candidates, they are organizing protest rallies.

Protests are fine, but they aren’t competition for the massive and hugely successful political pressure machine on the right.

From the part the op left out:
“The religious left, having been largely eclipsed in recent years, has a ways to go before it can match the clout of the religious right. Butler's group and those allied with it have primarily kept their focus on protest rallies and social media campaigns. Conservative religious groups, with 40 years of organizing experience, conduct sophisticated campaigns in support of those candidates whose views align with their own.”

Bretton Garcia

(970 posts)
26. The Right has the 24/7 Fox media outlet; that dwarfs any left output
Sun Jan 27, 2019, 04:26 PM
Jan 2019

Not to mention AM. radio; which is heavily right wing.

Not until the left has the same thing, answering Fox point by point, will it be effective.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)
8. It's good to have a counterweight to the religious right
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 11:06 AM
Jan 2019

Even if it is never as large as the religious right it ends their monopoly over religious political action.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
10. And it broadens the dialogue.
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 12:22 PM
Jan 2019

Far too much of the media focus is on the conservative religious right. And as progressives, we need to reach out to natural allies.

Voltaire2

(14,632 posts)
14. Zero.
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 02:15 PM
Jan 2019

They are organizing protests not voters.

Protest politics is fine but it generally doesn’t elect anyone.

And also I object to “have to start somewhere”. There are many existing political organizations seriously organizing voters around progressive issues and candidates. They just aren’t explicitly religious.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)
15. So your entire objection is just that this group only organizes protests
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 03:11 PM
Jan 2019

which are actually "fine," but don't meet your criteria for effectiveness? Somehow I doubt that is your real concern.

Voltaire2

(14,632 posts)
16. The "concern" about effectiveness was spelled out clearly
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 04:29 PM
Jan 2019

in the article. It isn’t “my” criteria. I didn’t write the article. The article, again not written by me, clearly notes that the current religious left is not an effective counter force to the religious right because it is not even involved in electoral politics.

My concern, not the article’s, is indeed about the role of religious based political activism in a secular society. You appear, through your comment that we “Have to start somewhere“, to believe that religious based political activism is required. I not only disagree, but think it is dangerous and wrong.

Major Nikon

(36,899 posts)
17. We just need more gun nuts to keep us safe from the gun nuts
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 04:55 PM
Jan 2019

The answer to irrationality isn't more irrationality.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)
19. People are irrational
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 07:18 PM
Jan 2019

If you wait for them to become rational before they are allowed to organize themselves and do something, you'll be waiting a long time. And they won't be asking for your permission or seek your advice.

Major Nikon

(36,899 posts)
20. You have this exactly backwards
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 09:17 PM
Jan 2019

The religious right dipshits aren't seeking their advice and if you think that's going to change you will be waiting a long time. Meanwhile the left is apathetic at best to what they are preaching and won't be seeking their advice anytime soon either.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)
21. Not really looking to reach the unreachable
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 09:25 PM
Jan 2019

There's always a few who looking for a change or are undecided. Usually younger and not so set in their ways. Or sometimes a life event changes their point of view.

Major Nikon

(36,899 posts)
22. They aren't going to reach the reachable either
Sun Jan 27, 2019, 12:03 AM
Jan 2019

It's not going to be any group nobody has ever heard of that reaches those who haven't closed their mind completely. It's going to be for other reasons, as you say.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)
23. If not this group, then there are others I heard of
Sun Jan 27, 2019, 12:53 AM
Jan 2019

There is the Poor People's Project Campaign led by Reverend Barber,
https://www.poorpeoplescampaign.org/

there are the Red Letter Christians
https://www.redletterchristians.org/

I've read articles about students in evangelical seminaries who don't want to follow their racist, misogynistic, homophobic elders.

I think there is sharp leftward shift happening in the country, and it's even being felt in churches.

marylandblue

(12,344 posts)
18. Yes, I think having a religious leftism is beneficial
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 05:01 PM
Jan 2019

Many people aren't giving up religion any time soon. There are more atheists than there used to be, but still not many. For religious people, most of the religion-based political messaging comes from the right. I think if there were more such messages coming from the religious left, it would attract some people away from the right.

My position has always been that progressive religion is not harmful. Most of the harm from religion comes from conservative and fundamentalist religion.

Igel

(36,010 posts)
25. The "religious left" is often overlooked
Sun Jan 27, 2019, 11:22 AM
Jan 2019

because it's both diverse (not in lockstep, so part of the left will deal with abortion and another, overlapping, part, with civil rights) and because it doesn't have a big flashing neon sign that says, "Religious Left."

Objections have been noted that the religious left isn't organizing voters.

Would people consider civil rights to be a bigger issue on the left than the right?

Are black churches religious?

Do black churches mobilize voters-registering them, having GOTV drives, even driving voters to the polls?

In many ways, they are part of the religious left. But only part and partially.

It's largely the same with a lot of the "religious right". They don't march in lockstep. They have this nifty PR campaign that ended a couple of decades ago to convince outsiders that they do march in lockstep. It's an exaggeration. But it was so successful that not only do people did believe the exaggeration, but 20 years later they still parrot it.

Note that in some ways, many black churches are also part of the "religious right." But again, branding isn't always accurate so they're not "religious right" for branding purposes--and the branding is deceitful in that it masks a lot of diversity.

Act_of_Reparation

(9,116 posts)
27. Newsflash:
Mon Jan 28, 2019, 08:34 AM
Jan 2019

The RR doesn't dominate the news cycle because they have a "PR firm". It's because they have the numbers. The religious left does not. End of story.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
28. Shh, that doesn't fit the preferred narrative.
Mon Jan 28, 2019, 09:45 AM
Jan 2019

You know, the belief that the religious right is just a tiny vocal minority and the vast majority of Christians in this country are ultra-liberal and also btw they won't vote for Democrats if atheists say bad things about religion on an anonymous Internet message board so STOP SCARING THEM AWAY YOU FILTHY ATHEIST.

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