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guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
Fri May 10, 2019, 07:43 PM May 2019

Vatican law: Priests, nuns must report sex abuse, cover-up

From the article:

Pope Francis issued a groundbreaking law Thursday (May 9) requiring all Catholic priests and nuns around the world to report clergy sexual abuse and cover-up by their superiors to church authorities, in a new effort to hold the Catholic hierarchy accountable for failing to protect their flocks.
The new church law provides whistleblower protections for anyone making a report and requires all dioceses around the world to have a system in place to receive the claims confidentially. And it outlines procedures for conducting preliminary investigations when the accused is a bishop, cardinal or religious superior.


To read more:

https://religionnews.com/2019/05/09/vatican-law-priests-nuns-must-report-sex-abuse-cover-up/
28 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Vatican law: Priests, nuns must report sex abuse, cover-up (Original Post) guillaumeb May 2019 OP
In the USA it has been the law to report sex abuse for a long time. He has been Pope for some time. JoeOtterbein May 2019 #1
This applies worldwide. eom guillaumeb May 2019 #3
Why not just tell your priests and nuns around the world to call the God-damned cops! eom thewhollytoast May 2019 #2
That is an option. guillaumeb May 2019 #4
We know the reason. trotsky May 2019 #7
Makes it easier to cover up that way Major Nikon May 2019 #9
The Pope supports the seal of the Confessional. guillaumeb May 2019 #10
So you feel their religious belief that they are above the law is justified. trotsky May 2019 #11
My belief is that the Pope does believe this. guillaumeb May 2019 #13
The closest you've come to taking a stand on that topic is to say you're "not sure." trotsky May 2019 #14
If one eliminated the seal of the Confessional, guillaumeb May 2019 #15
Answer the question, please. trotsky May 2019 #16
What does US law say? guillaumeb May 2019 #17
I don't care what US law says. I'm asking for your opinion. trotsky May 2019 #18
If you wish to ignore the law, and the actual facts, guillaumeb May 2019 #19
I'm asking for your opinion. trotsky May 2019 #23
Do you believe that all US laws are morally sound? MineralMan May 2019 #20
I understand your opinion. guillaumeb May 2019 #21
What does that have to do with not following the law? MineralMan May 2019 #22
Yes, laws can be changed. guillaumeb May 2019 #26
We also have civil disobedience. MineralMan May 2019 #27
It's really wierd that you think your former occupation renders your opinion irrelevant. marylandblue May 2019 #28
Ah, so it's OK, then? MineralMan May 2019 #12
He won't answer otherwise, so we can only assume that yes, he thinks it's just fine. trotsky May 2019 #24
Silence Shouts Truth! MineralMan May 2019 #25
Still trying to keep it all in the family. Sex abuse should be reported to law enforcement PERIOD emmaverybo May 2019 #5
A joke. trotsky May 2019 #6
Old story, already posted in this group MineralMan May 2019 #8

JoeOtterbein

(7,783 posts)
1. In the USA it has been the law to report sex abuse for a long time. He has been Pope for some time.
Fri May 10, 2019, 07:49 PM
May 2019

I guess the Pope is looking for credit now?

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
7. We know the reason.
Fri May 10, 2019, 08:08 PM
May 2019

They are dedicated to their religious beliefs that the church hierarchy is above secular law.

Major Nikon

(36,899 posts)
9. Makes it easier to cover up that way
Fri May 10, 2019, 08:21 PM
May 2019

Also gives the child rape apologists ammo to claim the RCC is actually doing something besides telling the rapists the devil made them do it.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
14. The closest you've come to taking a stand on that topic is to say you're "not sure."
Wed May 15, 2019, 07:28 AM
May 2019

So have you made up your mind yet?

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
15. If one eliminated the seal of the Confessional,
Wed May 15, 2019, 10:07 AM
May 2019

what would change?

Would predators give up predation, or give up Confession?

Experience suggests the latter.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
16. Answer the question, please.
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:09 AM
May 2019

What you posted was not an answer.

Do you feel their religious belief that they are above the law is justified?

Yes or no.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
17. What does US law say?
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:12 AM
May 2019

If US law allows for this, as it allows for legal confidentiality, the answer is obvious. My opinion is irrelevant. But their are reasons that legal confidentiality and the seal of the Confessional are allowed.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
18. I don't care what US law says. I'm asking for your opinion.
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:20 AM
May 2019

Why are you afraid to provide it? Are you ashamed?

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
19. If you wish to ignore the law, and the actual facts,
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:25 AM
May 2019

I understand.

So do you accuse the entire US legal system of some sort of conspiracy?

If so, good luck with your narrative.

MineralMan

(147,334 posts)
20. Do you believe that all US laws are morally sound?
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:26 AM
May 2019

Your opinion might be irrelevant, but you could still share it. You never seem willing to do so, though.

I'll share mine, though:

No law should allow any religious exemption from notifying authorities of criminal acts.

That's my opinion. You're welcome to share yours.

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)
21. I understand your opinion.
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:29 AM
May 2019

But given that my job as a union representative required knowledge of applicable labor law, and handbooks and manuals specific to my union, my view is that if it is legal, there is a reason for that.

You may not agree with the logic behind the reason, but that is irrelevant.

MineralMan

(147,334 posts)
22. What does that have to do with not following the law?
Wed May 15, 2019, 11:54 AM
May 2019

What does it have to do with not reporting crimes that occur. What does that have to do with religious exemptions from doing so.

Many laws have been changed because they were actually immoral and wrong. Slavery was once legal, but has always been wrong. Eventually, laws that made it legal were changed, because it was wrong

It has always been wrong to have sex with children. There are laws requiring most people who have contact with children to report even the suspicion of sexual abuse against them. There is a legal exemption for priests. That exemption is immoral and wrong. It allows crimes against children to continue, even though they are known, but are not reported due to that exemption.

Immoral laws must be changed. Immoral laws should not be followed. If slavery was legal, would you own slaves? If it was not illegal to have sex with children, would you have sex with children.

It is legal for priests not to report people who confess they have had sex with children. That is an immoral law, because the safety and personal rights of a third party are involved. It is against the law to have sex with children. There should be no exemptions from reporting known violations of such laws. Not for anyone.

You say you follow the laws. Are there no possible laws you would not refuse to follow? There certainly are for me.

Legalism can lead to harm to innocent victims. That is the real question here. Are you, then, a legalist?

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
24. He won't answer otherwise, so we can only assume that yes, he thinks it's just fine.
Wed May 15, 2019, 01:10 PM
May 2019

And is ashamed to admit it.

MineralMan

(147,334 posts)
25. Silence Shouts Truth!
Wed May 15, 2019, 02:28 PM
May 2019

Yes, indeed, it does.

Some people use discussion forums as playgrounds. Some children on playgrounds find it amusing to throw sand in other people's eyes. Eventually, someone throws sand into their eyes, in return. That becomes an object lesson for some people. For others, it simply creates a need to escalate.

It's easy to provoke people. That doesn't take a lot of intellectual capacity. It's harder to actually argue a point. Too hard for some for whom throwing sand in people's eyes suffices as an amusement.

Some people are very persistent in their quest for amusement. Still, one can only sweep sand under the rug for a while.

MineralMan

(147,334 posts)
8. Old story, already posted in this group
Fri May 10, 2019, 08:12 PM
May 2019

This morning, and from a reputable news source.

Are things not news, in your opinion, until you find them at your source?

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