was a Christian. The rise of the "moral majority" made me ask myself what Christianity, and religion in general, really was. Now I am an agnostic, as you can't prove a negative.

helping and loving thy neighbor. Of course all religion, by it's nature, is ultimately exclusive and divisive, but I had not really questioned anything in my youth.

which era was the loving god era.

That statement is a negative, so if it were actually true means it's unprovable.

If anyone considers themselves agnostic, more power to them, but basing that on "you can't prove a negative" isn't the firm foundation some seem to think. We also can't prove beyond all possible doubt biblical people didn't live to over 900 years old. The same goes for talking donkeys, Russell's Teapot, and pretty much everything else we are reasonably certain didn't exist or happen. That doesn't mean we are obligated to entertain all unfalsifiable claims and remain on the fence about them. Extraordinary claims without evidence require no counter evidence to summarily dismiss.

Theists can't prove even one assertion about the existence of their various proposed gods, but I doubt you would say they aren't really theists because of that.

A theist believes one or more gods exist. An atheist doesn't believe any gods exist. Since it's a matter of belief, no proof or absolute certainty or any such thing is required to be either a theist or an atheist.

I realized long ago that you could have no reason whatsoever to believe other that it being repeated at you over and over, or that fact that so many others believe, so it must be true. I have never heard anything from anyone making any kind of logical case for believing. What they decide they want to pretend always comes down to only that. Other than blind faith, they have absolutely nothing and never will have anything more.

Religions fabricated on Earth by huMANs are hypocritical frauds that have created more wars and human suffering largely because of their absolute intolerance of one another.

He was convicted in Operation Graylord for taking bribes. I cannot think of a crime more despicable than selling justice. It isn't as heinous as murder, I suppose, but not too far behind.

I can see the need for organizations to cater to the money people, and I can excuse it to some degree. My synagogue always needed money. They always blew their budget because no one who came to the synagogue door was denied a hot meal or a place to sleep.

But it left a bad taste in my mouth for organizations. As Emerson said an organization takes on an importance of its own, beyond the actual human beings who make up the organization.

raised Catholic - altar boy and all that including 12 years of parochial schools.

Serving Mass I would see the folks from last nights parties taking the wafer the next day. Priest skimming a little from the collection basket. Lots of alcohol being drunk by the church leaders. So on and so on.

My school had a principal who still has lawsuits wandering through the court system for child molestation. One of the priests was the go to to buy beer for the high schoolers. On and on.

The espousing of beliefs to help the poor, not be bigoted etc. which was pretty much ignored by all. Just seemed like it was all window dressing with nothing behind.

This caused me to dig deeper into the "beliefs." That just made me believe it was so much hokum.

The deeper I dug the less there was. Eventually I sort of became an atheist by default. With the advent of the internet and access to all sorts of different thought, atheism became the only thing that made much sense.

Ironically it was my Catholic high school that turned me into a heathen, by exposing me to other belief systems and teaching me to seek answers and think for myself. My parents weren't too thrilled, LOL.

The group you were raised in sounds interesting (and somewhat familiar) to me. I was raised Seventh Day Adventist, and at the time it embraced many of the social restrictions that you noted. SDA doctrine is not truly Fundamentalist in the technical sense, but it can be very conservative (although it does range between ultra-conservative to liberal within the denomination).

I was raised in a very conservative congregation that I’ve observed liberalize somewhat over the years (I no longer attend, but much of my extended family does, and listening to them over the years has kept me abreast of some things).

I earned BA and MA in History, with a personal interest in how eschatological beliefs have influenced human behavior; or, stated another way, how does what groups believe about the future cause them to act in the present.
This interest was sparked by my experience as an SDA, a group with a well defined and prominent eschatology.

The Gospel Hall Brethren sounds like an interesting group to me. Do they issue any publications, or statements of belief?

Again, thank you for sharing such a personal story. I’m very happy that you were able to maintain a close relationship with your parents after leaving the group. Sadly, this is not always the case.

with each other

More info:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_Hall_Assemblies

I’m just finishing The Coming Deliverer: Millennial Themes in World Religions. It has a relatively lengthy treatment of John Nelson Darby, dispensationalism, and the Brethren groups associated with him.

It didn’t specifically talk about The Gospel Hall group, but it did discuss both the Open and Exclusive Brethren groups.

You’ve piqued my interest in the group.

From Wikipedia,
The God gene hypothesis proposes that human spirituality is influenced by heredity and that a specific gene, called vesicular monoamine transporter 2 (VMAT2), predisposes humans towards spiritual or mystic experiences.[1] The idea has been proposed by geneticist Dean Hamer in the 2004 book called The God Gene: How Faith is Hardwired into our Genes.


I love the study of religion, I just don't buy it.

for decades, I just drifted into what I called agnosticism at the time. Then, 9/11 happened, and I was emboldened enough to fully admit that I was atheist.

Catholic school, sixth grade. There weren't very many nuns at that time, but a new one joined the convent that year. Her job was to play the organ and give music instruction.

Did I say she was a knockout? Very young and with a great figure. She wore civilian clothes when she wasn't working. I'll always have an image of her wearing a tight blue dress, walking downtown.

That summer, puberty set in, and I looked forward to seeing her again. Alas, she was no longer there.

I'm not trying to be funny here and make this about sex. I considered her a rebel and thought she was courageous in keeping her own identity. I began to think for myself then about all the rules of the church.

My dad was Catholic, and mom Protestant, and when I was born, my dad wanted my brother and I to be baptized. The priest refused because as non-catholics, my brother, mom, and myself were all going to hell. (Basically the church was pressuring my dad to convert the rest of the family.)

So my dad walked out and informed him on the way that 'he'd see him in hell too'. There ended the formal religious overtones of my family.

So, I read a lot. A lot, a lot. I mean, kind of a pallid, unhealthy-looking-in-the-sun amount. In my reading, I read a pile of books on Greek, Roman, Norse, and Persian mythology. It was all very interesting, but struck me as made up, and clearly society has discarded it as not true. (Mythos)

Then I encountered a NIV bible. Read it. Was similarly unimpressed. Checked out a number of competing religions and philosophies.
I could see ways in which the stories and 'rules' in these religions might have served one purpose or another that was advantageous to society, but I couldn't see how any of them explained the universe or our place in it.

So I moved on. Read more. Learned more. Followed subjects like Cosmology. Found that while science in general may not have all the answers, it was at least asking what struck me as the right questions.

My father was a Unitarian minister, but had a strong conviction that any religious belief must be constantly questioned. He was very careful not to tell us kids (or anyone else for that matter) what to believe and instead just encouraged people to figure it out on their own. If asked, he would answer technical questions about religion, but never gave us sermons or forced us to participate in any instruction.

I just never developed any sort of religious belief. It's not as if I made a decision, I just as a child never even entertained the thought of having to chose.

Born into a fundamentalist family, I spent much of my 1970s youth as a member of an early megachurch, one of the first in our area to televise services. At 8, I invited Jesus into my heart to be my Lord and savior.

I dutifully read the Bible cover-to-cover several times (not including the Devil's Apocrypha, of course). Southern Baptists are very effective at making you feel guilty for attempting to think for yourself... Proverbs 3:5 got a lot of airplay: "Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding." Yet somehow we also claimed "the Priesthood of the Believer" that set us above those awful Catholics. Most of us ignored the contradiction and just deferred to the preacher and other teachers in the church. We were taught that the Bible is largely literal and also not to be questioned, lest we allow Satan a foothold that could land us in Hell.

For my undergraduate years, I attended the world's largest Baptist university. Ironically, that's where the cracks in my belief foundation really manifested. One of the required religion classes discussed the two creation stories of Genesis. I'm embarrassed to say that this totally blew me away... Despite having read the entire Bible several times, I had just glossed over the contradictions between the stories, to the point of not even noticing them. I began to feel betrayed that nobody had seriously made any attempt to discuss this in all those years of Bible Study, and that I had been subtly guided to ignore such issues.

I realized that if THIS part of the Bible was contradictory and merely reflected different cultural interpretations (pretty much killing off literal truth), then the whole damn thing was subject to the same problem. OK, sure, I was a little slow, but I got there.

It's not that I wanted to stop believing... Belief was comfortable! It was part of my identity, and I thought I needed that. Unfortunately, I no longer COULD believe. It simply wasn't possible. This was not a conscious choice, but rather a painful realization.

The loss was bitter for me. I had to let myself down slowly, going down the deist path at first. I spent years getting the bitterness out by arguing on various internet religious forums, even becoming an administrator on one of the larger religious forums for a time. This allowed me to hang on to a god belief but simultaneously let go of dogma. Eventually, I understood that deism was just theistic baggage I could safely release.

I am now an agnostic and atheist at the same time (those are NOT two points on the same continuum) and finally comfortable in my own skin. I can now truthfully offer blessings to you on whatever path you see fit to follow, so long as you don’t impose it on others.