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qwlauren35

(6,255 posts)
Wed Apr 24, 2024, 04:36 AM Apr 2024

Hate the Sin, Love the Sinner

A friend of mine, a liberal evangelical Christian, got into it with a MAGA evangelical Christian around this topic on Facebook. She had posted something about loving the LGBTQ community and he said that they should be judged and condemned. When she said no, he said "Do you Love Trump?"

I waited with baited breath for her answer.

She actually does. And she prays for him. But she hates his words and actions.

I was quite blown away by the largeness of her heart. It never occurred to me to pray for the man, because he seems irredeemable. But I understand that the fat lady has not sung yet, and if he fell hard enough, there is the teensiest chance that he would repent. Teensie, einsie, ittle, widdle chance. But until he dies... the fat lady has not sung.

I was challenged a while ago by my very non-Buddhist thought that Dylann Roof should get the death penalty. It goes against everything I have been taught. Every human being has a Buddha Nature, even if it buried deep, deep, deep by mountains of bad karma. If I believe in karma, isn't it enough that his karma will catch up to him. I am moving in that direction. So then there is Trump. Like every other human being on this earth, he is a Child of God. What a painful thought, to have to give him this wonderful, positive label. However, the other label that belongs to every human being on this earth is that he is a sinner. If you were to consider the 7 deadly sins (is that really in the Bible?), I think he's done them all.

The fact that he has committed crimes and defrauded people is something for the courts, and I hope he is punished to the full extent of the law. But of his soul, we are not supposed to judge. Only God is supposed to do that. We are not even supposed to second guess God's judgment. I may want him to burn in hell, but it's not necessarily going to happen.

At any rate, I wanted to ask - have you made the gargantuan effort to love Trump as a Child of God, and pray for his redemption, at the same time that you hate everything he says and does?

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Hate the Sin, Love the Sinner (Original Post) qwlauren35 Apr 2024 OP
I seem to remember an interview in which Haggard Celine Apr 2024 #1
If lying was one of the 7 deadly sins... qwlauren35 Apr 2024 #2
This was a major theme in my house growing up. bottomofthehill Apr 2024 #3
One of the reasons I love Speaker Pelosi bottomofthehill Apr 2024 #4
I have a couple of enemies mdmc Apr 2024 #6
With my twisted logic, I appreciate multigraincracker Apr 2024 #5
That's a variation on my own moral compass. ChazInAz Apr 2024 #8
Love your enemies Tbear Apr 2024 #7
Render unto Caesar... qwlauren35 Apr 2024 #9
I should, more so, but . . . The Great Open Dance Oct 4 #10

Haggard Celine

(17,001 posts)
1. I seem to remember an interview in which
Wed Apr 24, 2024, 04:49 AM
Apr 2024

Trump stated that he didn't commit sins. When you commit all the sins he's committed, that's like a big 'fuck you' to fundagelicals. Or, it should be. But they love him for picking anti-choice judges. I don't think they would care if it became known that he himself had paid for abortions. He's God's chosen leader after all. The fundagelicals have an inordinate amount of power in this country, and they will forgive anything Trump does, even if he contends that he's never committed a sin.

qwlauren35

(6,255 posts)
2. If lying was one of the 7 deadly sins...
Wed Apr 24, 2024, 04:58 AM
Apr 2024

Trump is such a master of it.

I don't think he knows what sin is, so of course he doesn't think he's committed any.

I would love for someone to ask if he loves God with all of his heart and loves Jesus as his personal savior.

bottomofthehill

(8,771 posts)
3. This was a major theme in my house growing up.
Wed Apr 24, 2024, 06:15 AM
Apr 2024

When I was really angry with someone, my mother would remind me that it was ok to hate the sun, but never hate the sinner. To pray for strength for me instead of ill for others.


bottomofthehill

(8,771 posts)
4. One of the reasons I love Speaker Pelosi
Wed Apr 24, 2024, 06:17 AM
Apr 2024

The Speaker talks about praying for trump. She really is the bigger, better person.

https://m.

mdmc

(29,162 posts)
6. I have a couple of enemies
Wed Apr 24, 2024, 09:50 AM
Apr 2024

and I struggle to see their divine nature. I struggle to pray for them.

I can, however, pray for Trump rather easily. I remember in 2004 when he came out against Bush and the Iraq war. It was amazing because very few people were against the war at the time.

multigraincracker

(33,913 posts)
5. With my twisted logic, I appreciate
Wed Apr 24, 2024, 06:30 AM
Apr 2024

having TFG around. I have a perfect example of how not to act. If I question what I’m about to do, I can just ask myself what would TFG do. Then I do the opposite.

ChazInAz

(2,766 posts)
8. That's a variation on my own moral compass.
Thu Apr 25, 2024, 07:57 AM
Apr 2024

Though I use my own father. He was an evil man. Officer in Hungary's military in WWII, then one of the nomenklatura in Budapest's municipal government until November 1956, when we hurriedly left the country for unknown reasons.
So...in moments of ethical confusion, I ask myself what my father would do. And do the opposite.

Tbear

(500 posts)
7. Love your enemies
Thu Apr 25, 2024, 07:28 AM
Apr 2024

Yes I have prayed for him a couple of times.
I believe the idea is to soften your heart towards your enemies.
In this case I didn’t put a lot of effort into it and the softening is fleeting at best.
Lock him up.

qwlauren35

(6,255 posts)
9. Render unto Caesar...
Thu Apr 25, 2024, 05:04 PM
Apr 2024

What happens in court and what happens in church are *supposed to be* different...

10. I should, more so, but . . .
Fri Oct 4, 2024, 11:27 AM
Oct 4

You have asked a profoundly challenging question. I'm certain that Trump is suffering continuously and deserves prayer, but when he shares his suffering with others I get angry and find it hard to practice my faith, alas. Perhaps I have some room for spiritual development . . .

Thank you,

Jon Paul Sydnor

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