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Jilly_in_VA

(10,795 posts)
Fri Oct 6, 2023, 10:17 AM Oct 2023

New Mexico footprints are oldest sign of humans in Americas, research shows

New research confirms that fossil human footprints in New Mexico are probably the oldest direct evidence of human presence in the Americas, a finding that upends what many archaeologists thought they knew.

The footprints were discovered at the edge of an ancient lakebed in White Sands national park and date back to between 21,000 and 23,000 years ago, according to research published on Thursday in the journal Science.

The estimated age of the footprints was first reported in Science in 2021, but some researchers raised concerns about the dates. Questions focused on whether seeds of aquatic plants used for the original dating may have absorbed ancient carbon from the lake – which could, in theory, throw off radiocarbon dating by thousands of years.

The new study presents two additional lines of evidence for the older date range. It uses two entirely different materials found at the site, ancient conifer pollen and quartz grains.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/oct/06/footprints-humans-americas-oldest-sign-new-mexico

Most likely did not come via "Siberian land bridge"...so where?

8 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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New Mexico footprints are oldest sign of humans in Americas, research shows (Original Post) Jilly_in_VA Oct 2023 OP
thanks for article. Where? I do not have the foggiest idea. riversedge Oct 2023 #1
DNA studies show waves of Asians migrated to Alaska and their DNA mixed in isolation for millenia Doc Sportello Oct 2023 #2
+1 2naSalit Oct 2023 #4
I can think of one possibility... 2naSalit Oct 2023 #3
1491 is one of the best histories of the Americas ever Doc Sportello Oct 2023 #5
There was so much in that book... 2naSalit Oct 2023 #6
Really cool science. Isn't it possible that before sea levels were low enough to raise the land Martin68 Oct 2023 #7
Certainly not 20,000 years ago, but markodochartaigh Oct 2023 #8

Doc Sportello

(7,957 posts)
2. DNA studies show waves of Asians migrated to Alaska and their DNA mixed in isolation for millenia
Fri Oct 6, 2023, 11:14 AM
Oct 2023

Some came by a land bridge and others probably skirting the coasts in canoes as they moved southward. Today's Native Americans have a unique genetic footprint due to the mixing.

snip

The first Americans were descended from Asians, and they reached the New World by way of Beringia, a now-submerged land bridge that used to connect Asia to Alaska. Recent research suggests they followed the shorelines of Beringia and the Pacific Coast as they spread into the Americas by at least 15,000 years ago.

The new paper supports a theory that the migrants from Asia spent thousands of years in isolation, either in Beringea or Asia, before entering the Americas. During that time they developed unique genetic signatures that are now found in natives of the Americas.

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/science/ancient-dna-gives-glimpse-of-ancestors-of-native-americans/#:~:text=Ancient%20DNA%20from%20Alaska%20gives%20glimpse%20of%20ancestors%20of%20Native%20Americans,-Originally%20published%20January&text=The%20new%20paper%20supports%20a,in%20natives%20of%20the%20Americas.

2naSalit

(92,009 posts)
3. I can think of one possibility...
Fri Oct 6, 2023, 11:25 AM
Oct 2023

Though I don't have the book handy anymore so I can't and won't include dates.

The concept in the book, 1491, a reassessment of archaeologic evidence was made. It's a really big book and took me a year to read and digest what I could from it. There is a lot of minute evidence that is more detail than I could deal with but the main thesis is; The land bridge and over to eastern pathways around great glacial masses concept is suspect. It is equally, if not more, likely that migration happened along the coast of the continent moving south to the next continent much sooner than was thought. The book provides detailed construction of this idea with over a thousand pages of description and notable speculation - which is part of the science - showing how they came to such conclusions.


There is more but years after reading it, that is one main thing that stands out for me. I was never comfortable with the land bridge is the only way, man story anthropologists were so comfy with. I had many discussions with faculty during my undergrad years about this. Hell, while I was in school, geologists decided that not only was there a Pangea, they decided there may have been a few or more. It found the book interesting in that it offered a solid basis for some idea other than the land bridge concept. Scenarios are offered which include some use of the land bridge but beyond that, there is speculation that migration down the coast happened a lot sooner than originally thought.

If there is someone more familiar with the book or the concept, please correct me if I'm missing the main theme or wish to add details!

Doc Sportello

(7,957 posts)
5. 1491 is one of the best histories of the Americas ever
Fri Oct 6, 2023, 11:44 AM
Oct 2023

I read it back when it was published, so some memories may be flawed. But for me the biggest takeaway was upending the traditional view of the Spanish colonization. Using texts from Spanish missionaires that were only discovered in the 70s I believe, he related how they told of the subjugation of the Taino people using brutal methods, including gallows, to enforce their will. The natives were expected to work as slaves. The original take by the missionaries that the Taino were quiet and submssive began to change as the natives began to resist the Spanish, and they began describing them in ways that justified the persecution of them.

2naSalit

(92,009 posts)
6. There was so much in that book...
Fri Oct 6, 2023, 11:49 AM
Oct 2023

There were many phases over thousands of years. One I liked was about a coastal group in Peru who had a fish economy and an agricultural economy a little ways inland and they had quite a community for some time but only figured out in the years before the book was published.

Martin68

(24,419 posts)
7. Really cool science. Isn't it possible that before sea levels were low enough to raise the land
Fri Oct 6, 2023, 01:16 PM
Oct 2023

bridge, vessels were used to island hop across the Bering Straits? We know that people on the coasts were very navigationally savvy with excellent nautical skills.

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