Like it or not, these people are Americans and we need their votes.

Obama won those votes.

But I don't think we do. We need to hit the newly minted or soon to be minted voting age demographics and the ones who didn't come out to vote. I understand the lesser of two evils vote, but I don't know how to reach those people if they really thought Trump was the lesser of two evils.

and it continues to not be the wave push we need.

Old people vote.

In 2008, the Obama vote got the young voters out only a few percentage above 2004, then they dropped way off in 2012. If Obama only got about 50% of them to come out, that's about as good as it'll ever get in the near future.

I can't find any hard and fast numbers about current 17-25 year old demographics, but I will say the advent and rise of social media makes reaching this age group a much different beast than even as recently as 8 years ago for that same age range. If everything I've read is correct, this group is larger than the baby boomer group.

8 years ago, this same age group was coming into or off of war, the recession, the housing market crash. This was when MySpace was still prominent and Napster was the go-to music source. Social media and access to information wasn't nearly as readily available as it is now. I feel like we need to find a way to engage this age group. Just my 2 cents. Lol!

Because maybe its the way that we are doing that outreach. Or maybe its what we are trying to sell them

Or it could be the people we are trying to reach. But with three+ major variables, I think its worth giving some thought to which one might be the issue.

Old people vote. Problem is that the same stats that one would use to prove that statment also show they vote conservative.

We've tried through college campuses, concerts, music/movie stars, technology. A ton actually.

Heck, we even threw "free college" at them this go around and turnout was still decent but not great along the primaries and general.

Getting rid of caucuses could help, but honestly I remember in my 20s I didn't think about voting, never looked it up, I had better things to do. I was busy and the government just felt too far away for me to care to look it up. I would've voted for whoever my parents told me to.

I think the correct demographic to go after is middle aged and older voters...they are consistent and have been for a while.

Obama tried the get the youth vote strategy

Obama won twice.

Hillary tried the rely on the older voters strategy.

She does not appear headed for the White house.

Needless to say, I am not persuaded.


I think its the sales pitch, myself. Hey, here's a concert, here's some words about free college that most of us know are just words unlikely to become any sort of reality. That sounds like trying to trade cheap trinkets for votes. Its not genuine. Its not gonna fly in the modern era. And hey.. look! it didnt.


But lets try it again and hope for a different result. That should work out really well.

True then and true now.

of what he actually said.

"opioids, meth and heroin."

Sympathy and help...or shorter lifespans?

If they vote Republican, it surely will be a dying demographic.

Why they are bitter is just as important as how that bitterness is made manifest.

More/relevant here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/111679295

It matters little as to the message brought into many of these small towns. Their bitterness will manifest itself in the bible, guns, and division. That is the point of the rest of the quote.

Many don't want to take the time to really look at what he was saying. It holds true today.

are pissed they often are not rational as to where they direct that anger.

Democrats have not done a great job selling themselves as the party of the workers who've lost out due to globalization. We've done a great job selling ourselves as the party of workers who can benefit from the shift to a export-led, services-based economy.

This is one of the realities of this election.

I'm rather sick of hearing people say that anyone who is white and blue collar is automatically a racist bigot. 30% of hispanics, many blue collar as well, voted for Trump. Are they racist?

Blaming it all on racism amounts to comfort food to soothe ideological and partisan angst.

...so resources can be concentrated on the Coasts. Makes losing more efficient and thorough!

People will tune out what they want and don't want to hear depending on what they can get. A Hispanic voter may think - "I need my job back and I try to follow the laws of this country, I'm not "illegal" so Trump's talk doesn't bother or affect me"

We can't keep evading the fact that millions voted for a demagogue, regardless of the reasons - whether convenience, self loathing - as in the case of Hispanic Trump Surrogate who essentially said that Hispanic Culture is a problem and "taking over" - or whatever other reason.

Millions of Americans knowingly voted for a bigot, either because the bigotry appealed to them, or it didn't rate highly on their list of disqualifying reasons to reject a candidate.

A lot about the exit polls was wrong, as evidenced by the fact that they had HRC winning.

A simple look at the precinct-by-precinct data will clearly show that Hillary did much better than that. Latinos were the one group she did better with than Obama.

... to change yesterday?!

the same people who championed these policies that left these small town white folks & others who voted for TRUMP unemployed & also refused to allow the Federal Government to invest in the future of this country to create many new industries & jobs that could have put many of these people back to work...Turned around & LIED TO THEM & used the financial crisis & told them that it was the Mexicans & "illegal immigrants" that caused their pain along with the policies of President Obama & the Democrats that have left them in the situation they are in & they bought it!! The Right used racial, xenophobic & religious bigotry to distract just enough "poorly educated" & racist whites to do their bidding at the polls! Not to mention the FBI & the Russians played a major role as well.

I hate to be cynical but all I can think about is who will be the next Democratic POTUS to come in & clean the freaking mess left by TRUMP & the GOP Congress only to be shamed while in office by of course the Right, but the media, and many cry baby blind Democrats not getting everything they wanted when they wanted it & the public & then another idiot Republican will be voted back into office!! Sorry but this is becoming an American theme!

It's a serious mistake if 'we' don't recognize it.

A Bigger Economic Pie, but a Smaller Slice for Half of the U.S.

'Even with all the setbacks from recessions, burst bubbles and vanishing industries, the United States has still pumped out breathtaking riches over the last three and half decades.

The real economy more than doubled in size; the government now uses a substantial share of that bounty to hand over as much as $5 trillion to help working families, older people, disabled and unemployed people pay for a home, visit a doctor and put their children through school.

Yet for half of all Americans, their share of the total economic pie has shrunk significantly, new research has found.

This group — the approximately 117 million adults stuck on the lower half of the income ladder — “has been completely shut off from economic growth since the 1970s,” the team of economists found. “Even after taxes and transfers, there has been close to zero growth for working-age adults in the bottom 50 percent.”'>>>

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/06/business/economy/a-bigger-economic-pie-but-a-smaller-slice-for-half-of-the-us.html?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/111679295

And the talk about identity politics is particularly absurd. Trump's entire campaign was about identity politics.

Employers used to take pride in paying "a living wage." Unions used to see people got one. Now the top tier wants it all and fuck everyone else.

Why do I say that? Because the time to have complained was 35 YEARS AGO, when Reagan declared open warfare on working people.

These white males do NOT give a shit about economics. They can't because they keep voting wrong time after time after time. All they live for is guns, God, and bigotry.

We do NOT need their votes. They can't be reached. They can't be reasoned with because their minds are closed. End of story.

This seemed to be the underlying theme. If one has ever worked a Telemarketing or Phone Center Job,you pick up on the nuances in the contacts voice,and this anger distrust thing was very evident with many people. Noticed it more in Rural areas. Hunch's many times tells one the real story.

this election started out with Jeb arriving like he was Junior at the family business. Massive financial war chest, journalistic revisionism of the W Bush era propaganda - a shoe-in.

then there was Ted Cruz, a cynic who had locked up the tea party and Evangelical vote

then there was Marco Rubio, an empty suit trading on a play for the Hispanic vote for the Republican party

there was Rand Paul, inheritor of the pot smoking libertarian conservatives, from his father Ron

and Carly Fiorina, a tech executive who united stockholders and workers in their hate of her

and Trump destroyed them all, mercilessly. Don't underestimate that was part of his appeal, a voting population that was mad at everyone, not just immigrants and muslims. They were angry with the *entire* political establishment, *including* Republicans

I think this point gets overlooked

Including major proponents of the TPP.

Divide and conquer plays on those fears, plays on those superstitions. People are being led by their limbic systems, because their limbic systems are in control, and that is very much the case because they are always in a state of some degree of economic uncertainty.

Adhere to Maslow's hierarchy of needs. If you want people to get beyond those bottom tiers that have them worried about scarcity and who is taking their shit, then you have to offer them a sense of stability here. Or, frankly, offer them a mother-fucking class war already, and turn that limbic fear towards the thing that actually ails them. By giving them this new and appropriate target of their frustrations, we can start to work on their compassion for the ones they've been blaming all this time. They are no longer the source of their fears, they are their brothers and sisters etc. in common cause. Just a little bit of mirror neuron activity and maybe we can start getting somewhere here, to the point where their sense of self, their esteem is tied to how they treat these populations of people that they had never previously truly seen as people.

They think illegals or minorities or women or public employees or unions or some other phony baloney sector is doing better at their expense. They are morons, complete and total morons.

THAT is the only thing about "economics" they care about. They keep voting GOP because of the idiot "social issues" and the pandering to prejudices.

I know all about Maslow, and it doesn't apply to people who cannot be reached. It is a waste of time and futile. You cannot EVER, EVER change that mindset that has been there since childhood and reinforced by religion and/or the military and further reinforced by hate radio and slanted media outlets like Fox.

There are millions upon millions of people who do NOT vote. THOSE are the people we should reach, not the bigoted, entitled white males.

because of their race and gender - and you know that they are inferior - because they're bigoted

do I understand you correctly?

thinking homosexuality is wrong or deviant in their own lifetimes and have even come around to gay marriage.

You are pointing out how people think as if it isn't continually reified by the media and the politicians in their localities, and yes their churches. We have to fight that message and not give up on people, and it shouldn't ever be our job to decide who and who can't be "saved."

If MLK had only gotten through to people who already saw him as human, his impact on American Consciousness would have hardly been as profound.

statement when it first became public. It seemed very astute.

They can't handle the truth if you tell them the truth they run to get their guns...

and someone to be angry at & to blame for whatever makes them angry - people who aren't like them are easy.

But it's Obama so no surprise he saw this coming back in 2008.

you are 100% right there. Trump actually said that the current minimum wage was too high.

So, people who say they voted for him because of economic insecurity can go fuck themselves.

But, Trump lies and distorts his way through the campaign - and wins the presidency because of it.

This country is so upside down...

When Buddha became enlightened, his 1st teaching came to be called the 4 Noble Truths, the first of which was the Truth of Suffering. We are all of us suffering. It's called the realm of Samsara, the realm of Suffering. We think that our egos are real solid things, and we blame external stuff as the cause of our frustrations, disappointments, failures, mistakes, rejections, abandonment, etc etc.

There's the suffering of suffering, such as physical and emotional pain and discomfort. The suffering of karma, experiencing the results and consequences of our bad and non-productive decisions and actions. And then a type of existential suffering, which is experiencing that everything that we desire is impermanent and ultimately unsatisfactory, as a means of gaining permanent happiness.

When we get in touch with our own suffering in its various forms, ideally it enables us to find compassion for the suffering of others. It is this lack of empathy and compassion for others that I find most alarming about the far RWers.