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Tuesday Afternoon

(56,912 posts)
Sat Aug 24, 2013, 07:15 AM Aug 2013

This message was self-deleted by its author

This message was self-deleted by its author (Tuesday Afternoon) on Mon Sep 9, 2013, 10:25 PM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

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This message was self-deleted by its author (Original Post) Tuesday Afternoon Aug 2013 OP
Which ones are the five year olds. rrneck Aug 2013 #1
This message was self-deleted by its author Tuesday Afternoon Aug 2013 #2
True that. rrneck Aug 2013 #3
This message was self-deleted by its author Tuesday Afternoon Aug 2013 #4
Unfortunately, that is what the Übermensch can be reduced to Fortinbras Armstrong Aug 2013 #5
Now look what you've done. rrneck Aug 2013 #6
According to Nietzsche, if [...] you are the Untermensch Sanddog42 Sep 2013 #7
Yes, it was the Nazis who coined that term Fortinbras Armstrong Sep 2013 #8
Now I'm confused Sanddog42 Sep 2013 #9

rrneck

(17,671 posts)
1. Which ones are the five year olds.
Sat Aug 24, 2013, 10:49 AM
Aug 2013

I haven't studied Nietzsche, but I don't think Übermensch can be reduced to "take what you want".

Response to rrneck (Reply #1)

rrneck

(17,671 posts)
3. True that.
Sat Aug 24, 2013, 11:16 AM
Aug 2013

It beats the hell out of some stupid formula cartoon that just promotes some equally stupid toy tie in.

It reminds me of this kid.



He's either a genius or he just took a giant bong hit.

Response to rrneck (Reply #3)

Fortinbras Armstrong

(4,473 posts)
5. Unfortunately, that is what the Übermensch can be reduced to
Sun Aug 25, 2013, 08:35 AM
Aug 2013

According to Nietzsche, if I am the Übermensch and you are the Untermensch and you commit an act which injures me, you are acting immorally. However, if I commit the exact same act, but it benefits me, I am acting morally. Any ethicist who says that the morality of an act depends on who the actor is can reasonably be said to be spouting crap.

No moral values apply to the Übermensch. The desires of the Untermenschen mean nothing at all. If the Übermensch wants to murder Untermenschen in job lots, that is just fine. The Nazis put that idea into practice -- leaving murder, torture, looting and general immorality as their legacy. It can certainly be argued that the Nazis misused this idea. However, it is the basis for the train of thought that led to Buchenwald, and Nietzsche cannot be absolved.

The basic problem I have with Nietzsche is that Nietzsche's denial of ethics means that anyone can call himself an Übermensch and "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law". So there is not just a direct line from Nietzsche to Josef Mengele, but a direct line to Aleister Crowley as well.

rrneck

(17,671 posts)
6. Now look what you've done.
Sun Aug 25, 2013, 11:03 AM
Aug 2013

Now I have to read the damn thing.

Sanddog42

(117 posts)
7. According to Nietzsche, if [...] you are the Untermensch
Sun Sep 8, 2013, 04:50 PM
Sep 2013

So, you're saying Nietzsche either coined or used the term Untermensch?

Fortinbras Armstrong

(4,473 posts)
8. Yes, it was the Nazis who coined that term
Mon Sep 9, 2013, 05:42 AM
Sep 2013

I probably should have said "non-Übermensch". It makes no actual difference to my argument.

Sanddog42

(117 posts)
9. Now I'm confused
Mon Sep 9, 2013, 05:57 PM
Sep 2013

Can't anyone be an Übermensch simply by electing to follow their own rules?
If so, then who are the "non-Übermensch" to whom Neitzsche was referring?
In other words, who did Neitzsche say was fair game for ubermenschen to prey upon?

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