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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

honest.abe

(9,238 posts)
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:39 PM Mar 2020

NY Times Op-Ed: The Simple Reason the Left Won't Stop Losing

How did the political left squander the opportunity that was the 2020 primary campaign?

The Trump presidency has created tremendous energy among progressives. More than half of Democratic voters now identify as liberal. Most favor “Medicare for all.” A growing number are unhappy with American capitalism.

This year’s campaign offered the prospect of transformational change, with a Democratic nominee who was more liberal than any in more than a half-century. Instead, the nominee now seems likely to be a moderate white grandfather who first ran for president more than 30 years ago and whose campaign promises a return to normalcy.
--snip--
The biggest lesson is simply this: The American left doesn’t care enough about winning. It’s an old problem, one that has long undermined left-wing movements in this country. They have often prioritized purity over victory. They wouldn’t necessarily put it these terms, but they have chosen to lose on their terms rather than win with compromise.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/08/opinion/sanders-democratic-primary.html

This is a very good article in my opinion. Sanders and his campaign have focused too much on appealing to the fringe of the Democratic party. In fact so much so, he has probably done more harm than good to the progressive movement.

NOTE: There is a paywall but you might be able to get through it by going incognito. That worked for me.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
35 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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NY Times Op-Ed: The Simple Reason the Left Won't Stop Losing (Original Post) honest.abe Mar 2020 OP
I think Warren Turin_C3PO Mar 2020 #1
Indeed. Warren was much closer to a "practical" progressive. honest.abe Mar 2020 #2
I ageee ismnotwasm Mar 2020 #3
Sanders had four years to build a coalition or adjust tactics. TwilightZone Mar 2020 #4
From the beginning of Bernie's campaign he painted the Democratic party as the enemy still_one Mar 2020 #5
a candidate incapable of team building and welcoming a variety of views fares poorly nt msongs Mar 2020 #6
Many have realized that many others don't want 'transformational change,' elleng Mar 2020 #7
People got bored with Sanders. NYMinute Mar 2020 #8
The left practices "Linear Politics" (I am trademarking that phrase.) Yavin4 Mar 2020 #9
That's a good description, almost like bit or boolean logic Hav Mar 2020 #17
I trashed this NYT op because it's not accurate. Democrats didn't lose in 2008 and 2012 when abqtommy Mar 2020 #10
I dont think the author is referring to past elections. honest.abe Mar 2020 #13
I don't really talk too much about the popular vote from 2016 because I feel it lets James Comey StevieM Mar 2020 #23
Personally I think the Democratic Party has gotten old and comfortable* and scared pecosbob Mar 2020 #11
Well that's helpful. honest.abe Mar 2020 #12
I know it's not...I get this way every four years pecosbob Mar 2020 #14
Thank you for expressing the losing attitude referred to by the NYT so well. highplainsdem Mar 2020 #16
The fact is I vote...every time...attitude has nothing to do with it pecosbob Mar 2020 #19
Thanks for voting anyway, every time. I've voted in plenty of elections where I highplainsdem Mar 2020 #21
This isn't about being fat and scared Hav Mar 2020 #20
And I would agree with most of your points pecosbob Mar 2020 #22
The inability to compromise was meant more in a general way Hav Mar 2020 #29
Absolutely pecosbob Mar 2020 #30
... or no one wants to burn the house down to save it? tia uponit7771 Mar 2020 #25
Good analogy, but wasn't that Matt Gaetz I saw playing with matches in the cloak room? pecosbob Mar 2020 #27
+1, he was trying to burn the mask off his face ... he forgot how he put it on uponit7771 Mar 2020 #28
KnR NCProgressive Mar 2020 #15
Perhaps a 'socialist' can't be elected in the US. At least 'socialist' ideas are acceptable. pampango Mar 2020 #18
You could be right. CaliforniaPeggy Mar 2020 #24
Agreed. I am wedded to the ideas/policies, not the candidate. pampango Mar 2020 #31
"The biggest lesson is simply this: The American left doesn't care enough about winning." Ferrets are Cool Mar 2020 #26
the biggest lessson for me... stillcool Mar 2020 #32
I Think ArroganceIs Part Of It Me. Mar 2020 #33
Sanders and Warren split the "Left", whatever that is. maxsolomon Mar 2020 #34
Because they always run against the Democratic Party Hortensis Mar 2020 #35
 

Turin_C3PO

(15,888 posts)
1. I think Warren
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:43 PM
Mar 2020

would have done much better if Sanders wasn’t in and the media wasn’t misogynistic. Progressivism will do well though as more Trump voters die and the millennials start voting in greater numbers. Sanders is certainly not the be-all, end-all of left wing politics.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

honest.abe

(9,238 posts)
2. Indeed. Warren was much closer to a "practical" progressive.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:45 PM
Mar 2020

She could have won have things gone a bit different.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ismnotwasm

(42,454 posts)
3. I ageee
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:49 PM
Mar 2020

I get repeatedly told I’m gender doesn’t matter, but you know? It really, really does

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

TwilightZone

(28,833 posts)
4. Sanders had four years to build a coalition or adjust tactics.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:49 PM
Mar 2020

Instead, his campaign strategy was to get 30% of the vote, get a plurality, and then demand the nomination.

When your entire strategy is based on luck, timing, and then demanding something from the very people you've been targeting for decades, it shouldn't be a surprise when it fails in the end.

Some would argue that he almost got away with it, but I would argue that the race was always closer than it appeared, especially going into SC. Biden was always going to do well in SC, and the wild swing in the projections based on a couple of states never made sense.

Yes, the coalescing of candidates and the party behind Biden undoubtedly helped, but if Sanders had built a coalition of his own over the years instead of alienating those would who have formed said coalition, it might have been an entirely different race.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(96,523 posts)
5. From the beginning of Bernie's campaign he painted the Democratic party as the enemy
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:50 PM
Mar 2020

and his hiring of Jill Stein supporter Gray, and Hillary hating Sirota and Turner only highlighted that strategy

When you disparage 70% of the party you are running under, is it a surprise that Sanders has not been able to attract people beyond his base?

Surrogates have doubled down on this " war against establishment Democrats "

so is this really a surprise?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

msongs

(70,170 posts)
6. a candidate incapable of team building and welcoming a variety of views fares poorly nt
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:55 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

elleng

(136,043 posts)
7. Many have realized that many others don't want 'transformational change,'
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:56 PM
Mar 2020

'return to sanity/normalcy' more appealing to BROAD electorate, which we MUST attract this time. imo.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

NYMinute

(3,256 posts)
8. People got bored with Sanders.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 01:57 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Yavin4

(36,366 posts)
9. The left practices "Linear Politics" (I am trademarking that phrase.)
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 03:08 PM
Mar 2020

What do I mean by "Linear Politics"? I mean they only want pols, voters, media, etc. who lie on the same line as they do. Being near the line is not enough. Even more, being near the line in their eyes is worse than being far away from the line. No, you must be on the line perfectly.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hav

(5,969 posts)
17. That's a good description, almost like bit or boolean logic
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:27 PM
Mar 2020

Especially the point about being the bigger enemy the closer you are to their position. Reaching 80% with a Dem is the bigger travesty than steps in the opposite direction under Trump.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

abqtommy

(14,118 posts)
10. I trashed this NYT op because it's not accurate. Democrats didn't lose in 2008 and 2012 when
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 04:33 PM
Mar 2020

we elected Barack, or in 2016 when we elected Hillary but got ratfucked. If that's what the Times calls
"losing" then I'm all for it. And I'm very disappointed so many people here at DU took this sucker bait...

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

honest.abe

(9,238 posts)
13. I dont think the author is referring to past elections.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:17 PM
Mar 2020

He is talking Sanders and the progressive left.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

StevieM

(10,540 posts)
23. I don't really talk too much about the popular vote from 2016 because I feel it lets James Comey
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:47 PM
Mar 2020

off the hook for what he did.

Hillary was heading towards a decisive electoral college victory before he intervened. And that was after he pulled his devastating stunt in July with that ridiculous press conference. Had he not done that she would have obliterated Trump.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pecosbob

(7,904 posts)
11. Personally I think the Democratic Party has gotten old and comfortable* and scared
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:12 PM
Mar 2020

For those of you who are uncertain or frightened or confused, listen to the youth...they will point the direction that history will take, whether it's a direction you like or not. If you insist on any other path, you are blocking progress.

Oh, yeah...and fuck the NY Times Editorial Department.

*Self-edited for an insensitive term.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

honest.abe

(9,238 posts)
12. Well that's helpful.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:15 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pecosbob

(7,904 posts)
14. I know it's not...I get this way every four years
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:20 PM
Mar 2020

when it seems every pundit in the entire world is telling us to vote moderate or conservative...and then we go moderate and lose, more often than not.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

highplainsdem

(52,344 posts)
16. Thank you for expressing the losing attitude referred to by the NYT so well.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:23 PM
Mar 2020

FWIW -- since I doubt you'll consider this viewpoint -- "the youth" can point any damn direction they want (and they'll point multiple directions since they aren't a single bloc with only one opinion), but unless they can build a coalition large enough to win elections, they'll get nowhere with their finger-pointing.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pecosbob

(7,904 posts)
19. The fact is I vote...every time...attitude has nothing to do with it
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:31 PM
Mar 2020

If we don't bring more people to the polls, we will lose again. Many think we can win running the same sort of candidate we have run in the past. I do not.


Not Undecided...I voted for Warren.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

highplainsdem

(52,344 posts)
21. Thanks for voting anyway, every time. I've voted in plenty of elections where I
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:46 PM
Mar 2020

wasn't crazy about our candidates, but they were still much better than the Republican alternatives.

Re bringing more people to the polls -- there's no evidence from the primary race so far that the wave of new voters Sanders has talked about is materializing.

I don't blame progressives for often overestimating how many people agree with them. They're probably going on their own experience, what they hear from their friends. I remember Seth Abramson tweeting some time back that he didn't know a single person who supporter Biden. And as bizarre as that sounded, I believe he believes that -- that he's surrounded by likeminded people, and maybe those who disagree with his views simply don't tell him. People often exist in bubbles they're unaware of.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hav

(5,969 posts)
20. This isn't about being fat and scared
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:44 PM
Mar 2020

This is about what can be achieved. Progress isn't just one path and everything else is a dead end. Not one person has the right to claim that only his positions are the right ones. You couldn't have possibly proven the article right in a clearer way. Losing with purity over progress results in no progress at all. The inability to compromise and find common ground ends in achieving nothing at all. Calling something a revolution might sound fancy and cool but in a society, we move when there is a consensus. BS clearly failed in generating enough support and he failed in persuading the voters he could implement his plans.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pecosbob

(7,904 posts)
22. And I would agree with most of your points
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:46 PM
Mar 2020

but I do have the ability to compromise...that is exactly what I did when I voted for a Democratic candidate in the general that I did not support in the primary.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hav

(5,969 posts)
29. The inability to compromise was meant more in a general way
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:10 PM
Mar 2020

as it is something I often see from BS supporters but in part also aimed at the line about blocking progress. I get that you understand what is at stake this November and I also think that despite differences, Biden clearly offers progress on many issues. The more important point is, for the sake of progress, the different factions of the left shouldn't sabotage each other if one of them is in the minority.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

uponit7771

(91,754 posts)
25. ... or no one wants to burn the house down to save it? tia
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:51 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pecosbob

(7,904 posts)
27. Good analogy, but wasn't that Matt Gaetz I saw playing with matches in the cloak room?
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:01 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

uponit7771

(91,754 posts)
28. +1, he was trying to burn the mask off his face ... he forgot how he put it on
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:02 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pampango

(24,692 posts)
18. Perhaps a 'socialist' can't be elected in the US. At least 'socialist' ideas are acceptable.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:28 PM
Mar 2020

"More than half of Democratic voters now identify as liberal. Most favor “Medicare for all.” A growing number are unhappy with American capitalism."

It looks like Sanders will not be president. I am not happy but that is the way the game is played. At least some of his 'socialist' policies (which work just fine in capitalist Europe) are proving popular with Americans too. The future looks better.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

CaliforniaPeggy

(152,071 posts)
24. You could be right.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:48 PM
Mar 2020

But we'll need a different person to carry this message forward.

Sanders is too old now, and 4 years from now will definitely be a bridge too far.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

pampango

(24,692 posts)
31. Agreed. I am wedded to the ideas/policies, not the candidate.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:15 PM
Mar 2020

I give Bernie credit for presenting and popularizing the progressive ideas but they will survive his departure from the race, I hope.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Ferrets are Cool

(21,957 posts)
26. "The biggest lesson is simply this: The American left doesn't care enough about winning."
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 06:57 PM
Mar 2020

So much stupid here. Sheesh

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

stillcool

(32,768 posts)
32. the biggest lessson for me...
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:18 PM
Mar 2020

is that people do not care. They care about a Presidential election every 4 years, to elect one human being who can do absolutely nothing by themselves. They don't care who runs their states. Maybe they haven't experienced enough of life's harsh lessons, to learn enough to care.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Me.

(35,454 posts)
33. I Think ArroganceIs Part Of It
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:26 PM
Mar 2020

other politicals have said that BS thinks he knows more and is better than anyone else. If this is what's being called purity, I would also say, it makes them mean spirited about others and other's ideas.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

maxsolomon

(35,048 posts)
34. Sanders and Warren split the "Left", whatever that is.
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:35 PM
Mar 2020

I won't speculate why 78 (soon to be 79) year old Sanders didn't step aside after his heart attack and endorse Warren, but he didn't. That opened the door for the moderates to consolidate.

Not misogyny as much as that simple analysis.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
35. Because they always run against the Democratic Party
Tue Mar 10, 2020, 07:45 PM
Mar 2020

And there are a lot more Democrats than them. As said, it’s a lot less about winning than about acting out. But at base, just like their counterparts on the far right, their inability to respect or care about joining with others is a fatal and contemptible flaw that means they really shouldn’t win.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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