sanders' cap is near 30% https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/3/5/1924709/-Bernie-s-grievance-politics-consolidated-the-left-to-a-30-losing-minority

however he retained the delegate count difference of 150 delegates behind Biden after yesterday's results.

Am I correct?

This plan never made sense to me

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ill-conceived, at worst, delusional.

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Those cheering crowds are some strong juju.

Are very much like the extremes of right-wing groups who think that they are far more popular than they ever actually are, and that all it will take to persuade we mere peons who aren't on board right now is if we would listen to them for a change.

They don't grasp the reality that we've heard them, and still aren't interested.

It will never sink in for them, because they are all deluded about the awesomeness of their snake oil.

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get it.

If you were counting on a big field of candidates duking it out until deep into the primary season. The more chaos there was, the stronger his chances of getting a plurality of delegates on the way to the convention.

However, as the candidates started dropping out, one by one, the math got ever dicier for the BS campaign to thread the needle of getting the right number of delegates for a "divided" convention in Milwaukee that would benefit him. The bottom fell out when Bloomberg, Buttgieg, Klobuchar and Warren dropped out at long last, and we were in a political Thunderdome with "I don't need those annoying dumb women or minority voters only my over-privileged white male bros" BS vs. the tried-and-true, "we miss the sanity of Obama" Biden.

It was all over, then and there. Anybody with half a brain knew that, one-on-one, Biden was going to cream BS. Because it turns out that "progressives" aren't the base of the Democratic party.

WOMEN AND MINORITIES ARE.

I've been telling the berners about this reality for YEARS now on other forums, but of course I, a mere woman, couldn't know what I was talking about. Nope. Those bros were ever-so-much smarter than little ole me.

I was attacked for pointing this out 6 weeks ago. It was a massive miscalculation for both when they jumped on M4A so as not to be outflanked by Bernie.

...never have a chance to vote for her because in New Jersey our views on the candidates, as always, don't matter.

I am fine with Joe Biden; he's an excellent man and a fine human being, but I think Senator Warren might have been the Lincoln class politician we actually need now that the country has been so viciously raped and pillaged by a criminal traitor.

Stopped clock and all that.

the Washington Post.’

Hardly a surprise that she would see a liberal as having no ‘movement’. And why would we care that a conservative does not like one of our candidates?

If I am ever in the mood to play a version of that game I will go to a RW site, post an article by a liberal and dare conservative posters to refute that liberal. Perhaps that might expose some republicans to liberal thought and eventually win some of them over.

Is it just men who are capable of seeing the light?

The Revolution... forgot to vote.

Damn kids... shakes fist at sky...

here...

pretend they were made by someone else.

with the writer. That opens the door to RW trolls playing the game of posting conservative articles then asking "What's wrong with this? Look how perceptive this conservative is. Some liberals will agree with us."

When the same points are made by a non-conservative I will respond and have done so.

we usually disagree with conservatives, but it does not mean on every single issue. If a conservative said that water boils at 100 degrees centigrade, you're not going to disagree because they are a conservative.

If Bernie is not doing the things mentioned, you can argue about that whether Jennifer Rubin says it, whether Biden says it, whether Trump says it, or whether the boogeyman says it - it's the same point.

with it is, to my mind, questionable.

If I posted a liberal's opinion to a conservative board in the hope that conservatives would agree with it, I know why I would be doing that.

Nothing about this board prevents you from stating why Rubin is wrong.

Got it.

really good and accurate at nailing this liberal. Conservatives can make some really accurate observations. Food for thought." then yeah it is just ad hominem.

Reading 'accurate' observations from conservatives about Democratic candidates is not why I come to DU. If it works for you, more power to you.

liberals to agree with how perceptive and on point the conservative is. I understand why a conservative would want to do that - to 'open our liberal eyes' to the wisdom of a conservative columnist.

If I trolled RW sites I might do the same in reverse - attempting to 'open their conservative eyes' to the wisdom of a liberal columnist.

Another former conservative and Republican...

pretty much everything she said, and I also considered her an idiot. Ever since she became a NeverTrumper, she has produced article after article that have been insightful and interesting. A whole lot of what she wrote here is spot on. The fact that Rubin spent years writing Right-Wing rubbish does not make what she writes here any less true.

There you go.

A woman is criticizing Bernie, and thoughtfully, so that CANNOT go unanswered!!

You just "lol" and attempt to derail by ad hominem, lacking anything else to offer....

Why don't you just share another Jacobin screed? You could keep the thread kicked that way, too.

it's killer! I excerpted a couple of paragraphs in my posts.. I didn't even notice it was JR till I saw this sub thread. lol

Along with Joe Rogan's misogynist screeds - or perhaps those things aren't that really bothersome in men?

ouch .. that ought to hurt

more than Rubin ever has, especially now that she's a never Trumper. I think that someone who doesn't consider the Democratic Party to be as bad as Trump is preferable to Jacobin.

But, Rubin is a woman critiquing Bernie, so that's worse to some than Jacobin trashing Democrats, isn't it...



I know some people think that people don't actually change, but they'd be wrong.

I guess men can 'evolve," but women can't?

sanders is losing in the recent primaries because he has pissed off women voters.

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Last edited Thu Mar 12, 2020, 06:31 PM - Edit history (1)

candidate who was the least accomplished despite his fervor. They are still doing so no matter the
voters or the majority of significant democratic players, including 26 members of the CBC, who have endorsed Biden, a man widely respected here and throughput the world.

Excellent article!

..he had been in office how long before that??

It was moderates who flipped control of the House and sanders and his Our Revolution candidates did not fare well

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But....... instead of staying in Chicago when he got his BA or going back to Brooklyn to continue supporting desegregation, he went to Vermont.

Revolutionary....

By noticed I mean noticed by a handful of assholes who ratfuck from the left who encouraged him to primary Obama in 2012. He declined that but went the following cycle with their support.

a lot of opposition and he managed to get in as giving her some and the party thought that would be a good thing. He managed to get more attention that way. Had he run against Hillary, Obama and the rest in 2008 he would have been one of the crowd (likewise had he waited for this year).

And the raised fist! He should have trademarked it

I never considered sanders to be a serious candidate. sanders has zero major legislative accomplishments in large part because none of his fellow Democrats in Congress support his agenda. I do not understand the concept of a voter revolution . Without such a magical voter revolution, none of sanders' agenda could be adopted and I am not comfortable in relying on a magical voter revolution

I am not only one to doubt the seriousness of sanders as a candidate https://newrepublic.com/article/156883/gauzy-myth-sanders-campaign

That photo says differently.

I've said this many times, There are many things I agree with him, but he is not a Democrat.

and gop propaganda. He is the weakest dem candidate ever to seek nomination since McGovern.

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of praise for Bernie.

The movement didn’t show up for Bernie. The results are clear. So there really isn’t much of a movement. I could sit here all night tallying up all the races lost by Our Revolution candidates as well.

The would be president has no clothes.

The movement has no clothes.

About friggin time.

she's super Islamophobic, a normal conservative pundit, no one here should take her seriously.

Jacobin and the Intercept to name two.

BTW - people can change. Anyone who tells you otherwise is selling something.

I suppose you have nothing to say to rebut her points, other than an ad hominem?

it also doesnt matter at all as this is about Rubin, not those others.

the broad assertions that Bernie's demeanor in debates were "ranting, raving" and the extremely suspect criticism of him "yelling too much" just serves to sound super biased. I also don't think that really manifests much in public discourse? I've yet to see a Biden supporter say "Bernie sucks cause he's loud". So yeah Bernie is loud I guess? but he's not abrasive towards anyone, he's not running a campaign in which he gives playground bully nicknames to everyone else. His responses in the debates aren't really ranting or raving he's been pretty articulate. I just don't see how this point really contributes to the supposed major turn-off of dem voters.

When she runs down why voters don't like him in the third paragraph she seems to once again assert a bias that his policy is straight up socialism, has "venom-filled" rhetoric, and the talking point of how he's "not willing to compromise". The last one specifically has always been a weird one to me as I don't particularly think that having ideas that are different than the status quo means he's not one for compromise? I guess when it comes to m4a he's making the demand of no american lacking healthcare, I'll give Rubin that much even though her weird conservative slant towards implying it's socialism is stupid.

I agree with her on how social media shouldn't be used as a barometer for public perception yeah thats always been dumb.
Also she's not wrong about how dems going towards Biden want a safer option but that's not really a new idea, is it?

I'd say the progressive movement (as to include Warren as well because she did a whole lotta legwork) was a success on influencing the public discourse of the democratic primary, and by extension the general election. Also her claim that all demographics within the dem party agree to go with Biden is wrong. Younger voters (aged 18-44) prefer Bernie and tend towards being progressive, so in a sense the future of left leaning discourse has been influenced greatly.

So yeah Rubin's assessment of Sanders not having a movement seems pretty shaky and is filtered through a generic conservative lens so she's still awful in my book. Sure he's probably not gonna be the nominee but progressive ideas are becoming more and more commonplace among dem voters. We'll see how history turns out.

Welcome to DU, I have been on this site for years and years but post infrequently.

In this primary, I started to respond to the inauthentic and daily attacks on Bernie but have pretty much given up because there is no interest in actual unity, only in exercising the hatred that some posters here have against Bernie. Your post will probably go into the same Vacuum. I would not worry about it. The posters on this thread who assert that Bernis is this or Bernis is that are not representative of the Democratic Party as a whole who like both Biden and Bernie.

One of the attacks of this thread is a consistent point of attack with Bernie Haters that somehow he is unlikeable or abrasive or hand gestures when he talkss (ignoring of course the fact that Biden does the same as does Amy and Elizabeth in debating). With respect to whether people want to work with him, Bernie was one of the founders and the first chairman of the Progressive Caucus of the House appointed by fellow House Members. After the founding, more and more house members joined a group chaired by Bernie. He was then the chairman for the next 8 years till going to the Senate. My guess is that they must have made him chairman of the house caucus because no one could work with him and no one likes him and because he is abrasive to work with. EXTREME SARCASM IN THE LAST SENTENCE.

In fact, Bernie works well in coalitions with other people as pointed out by Hillary herself when he worked with her on Health Care (one that failed unfortunately). However, they find a person or article that asserts that a person does not like Bernie and claim that applies to everyone.

He is indeed on the left and most of his accomplishments are incremental by amendments of bills passed by the more corporate democrats and republicans. However, his issues constantly poll as popular amongst the electorate. So why did his bills not pass. Not because of the general support for the substance of his bills in the general electorate but because moderates and conservatives really don't want M4A or big changes to our society even those changes wanted by the electorate. However, because many people like and respond to him and his issues and moral tone (not the few one track haters who post every day) his issues have gained ground and at least are gaining ground in the general electorate who do ask, why do not have universal health care or a economic system that has such wealth disparity. This growth is not obviously him alone but he has helped rather than hinder such progress towards a better society. Hopefully eventually we will reach those goals and have the changes to our economic and political system that would make us a much better society.

Now, welcome to DU. Do not expect that your moderate post will have any affect on the attacks you see in this thread. if you continue to read DU, you will see the same attacks by the same posters day after day, hour after hour, and minute after minute. However, know that you are not crazy in your thoughts. DU's general hatred for Bernie is way out of step with the Democratic electorate. That hatred does exist in the Democratic Party electorate but it is a minority, not the majority as claimed by the people here.

Biden looks like the candidate and hopefully will be a good candidate but it is not because people hate Bernie or some characteristic as asserted by the active posters in this Thread. By all counts, the voters view Biden as a good man and more electable than Bernie and we can hope that the general electorate has judged correctly in giving Biden their vote to get Trump out.

On whether or not her assertions are correct in THIS article.

Because they are.

When all you have is ad hominem as a refutation, you lose.

They wanted someone to channel their grievance politics. The Sanders supporters online barely talked about policy and tried to sow dissent among the democratic voters about the party and anyone that disagreed with him was a neoliberal corporate shill controlled by Tom Perez and the media.

Sheesh - it'd feel like I moved back in with my unpleaseable mother. I'm sure she wanted the best for me, but Lordy! NOTHING I did was EVER good enough. Bernie strikes me as a grouchy old scold, whose demands are so extreme they can never fully be met. I'm sure he means well, but CRIMINY...

or some such

Founder: Bernie Sanders
Executive Director: David Sirota

The USA is far more to the left than the conservatives want it to be. But since the Reagan era, liberals have been shamed, shot, spit upon, and hounded by the right. There is more to come from the liberal side. Liberal policies are better for small businesses, which employ the greatest number of people in the country. Liberal policies put money into the pockets of the people who spend that money, and keep it circulating through the economy.

It is conservative policies that strangle the average person.

sanders not dropping out may help Biden. sanders keeps on losing primaries by large margins nnly strenghten's Joe's position https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/03/11/no-surprise-bernie-sanders-is-still-all-about-himself-never-party/

I never considered sanders to be a serious candidate. sanders has zero major legislative accomplishments in part because none of his fellow Democrats really want to support his agenda. I do not understand sanders' political revolution and how this revolution would somehow force congress to adopt his agenda. The only thing that is clear is that sanders attacks on other Democrats and the Democratic Establishment have backfired

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of his promises of everything and ability to accomplish nothing.

Nothing is more believable than that he doesn't understand the connection between his defeats and his rhetoric.

Without Russia's help, I feel sure he would have killed himself off in 2015, early 2016 latest. There's never been any there to his promises. All he could ever do with his one talent of self promotion was to sow conflict, and that only with enormous help from Repub-Russia.

Hi Cha