Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Bernie voted against the auto bailout? (Original Post) RandySF Mar 2020 OP
You heard it right! True Blue American Mar 2020 #1
Actually, he voted for the auto bailout as its own bill. He voted against it when it was... thesquanderer Mar 2020 #8
Regardless of what Sanders thought...the fact is that without it the autos would have gone under... Demsrule86 Mar 2020 #11
re: "the fact is that without it the autos would have gone under" thesquanderer Mar 2020 #12
It is completely true...the autos would have failed...rewriting history there. Demsrule86 Mar 2020 #16
re: "No one was in favor of bailouts" thesquanderer Mar 2020 #18
People were tired of bailouts....they were not popular and unless the money was released then , it Demsrule86 Mar 2020 #19
It was a fools errand for anyone to believe that we had all the time in the world. NurseJackie Mar 2020 #17
Exactly right. Some want to rewrite history...bailouts were not popular. The public was bailout Demsrule86 Mar 2020 #22
It would have been a disaster. Without the bailouts, we would have gone into a depression. It also still_one Mar 2020 #2
The the auto workers should vote against him in their state primaries and VOTE FOR JOE !!!! trueblue2007 Mar 2020 #4
I agree still_one Mar 2020 #5
Hard to believe DownriverDem Mar 2020 #6
They already did, last Tuesday. (n/t) thesquanderer Mar 2020 #7
Bernie votes against everything nt doc03 Mar 2020 #3
He votes for pure, pristine and flawless bills NCProgressive Mar 2020 #14
Sanders' revolution can only take place after devastation. Hortensis Mar 2020 #9
And remember Randy.. the auto bailout was a loan that got repaid with interest!! Peacetrain Mar 2020 #10
Yes ... and the loan was above market rates with stock as collateral NCProgressive Mar 2020 #15
Precisely!!! NC.. the republicans throw money down a rabbit hole Peacetrain Mar 2020 #21
Yes he did... and there's always some excuse or justification. NurseJackie Mar 2020 #13
For people that are basically ideologues, they will find SOMETHING wrong Blue_true Mar 2020 #20
 

thesquanderer

(12,350 posts)
8. Actually, he voted for the auto bailout as its own bill. He voted against it when it was...
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 04:51 PM
Mar 2020

...a small piece of a much bigger Wall Street bailout that he thought was structured poorly (essentially all benefits to the banks, all risks to the government/taxpayers).

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(71,024 posts)
11. Regardless of what Sanders thought...the fact is that without it the autos would have gone under...
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 05:44 PM
Mar 2020

so he voted against it and his excuses are meaningless as Michigan showed him last Tuesday. Sanders betrayed the unions in this case.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

thesquanderer

(12,350 posts)
12. re: "the fact is that without it the autos would have gone under"
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 05:52 PM
Mar 2020

As I recall, the argument at the time was, no, that wouldn't have happened, because there was no way SOME kind of Wall Street bailout was not going to happen, there were too many people in favor of it, on both sides of the aisle. So if that particular bill hadn't passed, it is not true that the banks and auto companies would all have gone under, but rather, everyone would have had to keep working to come up with a bill that would pass. But ultimately, the time pressure to get something done quickly was immense.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(71,024 posts)
16. It is completely true...the autos would have failed...rewriting history there.
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 06:07 PM
Mar 2020

No one was in favor of bailouts ...Sanders always seems to what is political expedient with a long winded explanation...nope autos would have failed, banks would have too...we would have been screwed...this is one of the reasons, I have never thought Sanders should be president...he can't bend when circumstances require it. Sanders deserved to lose Michigan and he should lose Ohio, Wisconsin..anyplace that depends on autos...he betrayed the working people with this vote.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

thesquanderer

(12,350 posts)
18. re: "No one was in favor of bailouts"
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 06:18 PM
Mar 2020

LOTS of people were in favor of them... that's why they passed! With a good amount of bipartisan support, no less.

re:

he can't bend when circumstances require it
Yes he can. He railed against the ACA and really wanted at least a public option in it, but when he couldn't get what he wanted, he still voted FOR the ACA, accepting that it was still better than voting against it. Similarly, he railed against the 1994 crime bill, and tried to get an amendment to get the death penalty out of it, but in the end, still voted for it, because of the violence against women provision. Every complex multi-faceted vote is a balance, and like all our representatives, you end up voting for a mix of good and bad, he's not a purist. But sometimes he'll come down on the side you wanted, and sometimes he won't. That's even without the other variables when it comes to voting, like your assessment of the odds of being able to get something better, or the knowledge of whether it has enough votes to pass or not regardless of how you vote (which gives you some more leeway to vote strictly on principle rather than pragmatism).
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(71,024 posts)
19. People were tired of bailouts....they were not popular and unless the money was released then , it
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 06:24 PM
Mar 2020

would have been over. Look you can defend Sanders if you choose...my husband worked for autos...they were hours away from failing when this vote was taken...it would have been too late and we would have had a depression too...I don't like Sanders, I don't think he would be a good president...sure if he were the nominee, I would vote for him but thankfully that is not the case...regardless of what might have happened later...Sanders voted against this bill and the banks couldn't be allowed to fail either...so there you have it...he made a very bad choice and none of his explanations move me one bit...nor it appears did it move the voters in Michigan.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
17. It was a fools errand for anyone to believe that we had all the time in the world.
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 06:07 PM
Mar 2020

But there's always going to be someone who needs to be grandstanding at at moment in history when being a gadfly was not being helpful. Ugh.

People haven't forgotten. Thankfully.

People also haven't forgotten his pro-Russia / anti-sanction votes ... or being "conveniently" absent.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(71,024 posts)
22. Exactly right. Some want to rewrite history...bailouts were not popular. The public was bailout
Tue Mar 17, 2020, 11:01 AM
Mar 2020

weary. Obama used political capital to save the banks and the autos...and that vote where Sanders voted no could very well have derailed the entire process if it failed. I expect we would have entered a depression. And isn't it funny how Sanders has all sorts of lofty excuses when in fact it is politically expedient for him to vote a certain way. Another example is the immigration bill which was supported by both Kennedy and Biden...but Sanders claims it was 'slavery'...and the gun votes show his love of excuses for votes that benefit him politically also.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(96,609 posts)
2. It would have been a disaster. Without the bailouts, we would have gone into a depression. It also
Sun Mar 15, 2020, 07:37 PM
Mar 2020

provided the Dodd Frank financial reform, which unfortunately trump and company are trying to undo


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

trueblue2007

(18,149 posts)
4. The the auto workers should vote against him in their state primaries and VOTE FOR JOE !!!!
Sun Mar 15, 2020, 07:41 PM
Mar 2020

FOR THAT REASON ALONE.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

DownriverDem

(6,656 posts)
6. Hard to believe
Sun Mar 15, 2020, 07:45 PM
Mar 2020

but some support trump here in Michigan.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

thesquanderer

(12,350 posts)
7. They already did, last Tuesday. (n/t)
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 04:50 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

doc03

(36,737 posts)
3. Bernie votes against everything nt
Sun Mar 15, 2020, 07:39 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NCProgressive

(1,315 posts)
14. He votes for pure, pristine and flawless bills
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 06:00 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
9. Sanders' revolution can only take place after devastation.
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 05:11 PM
Mar 2020

We're seeing how just a relatively little devastation is working for him. Not. Most people don't want to destroy what they know can work well. Revolutions need devastation that, combined with deceit, seems so dreadful that large numbers of people lose hope of rebuilding what we once had.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Peacetrain

(23,627 posts)
10. And remember Randy.. the auto bailout was a loan that got repaid with interest!!
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 05:16 PM
Mar 2020

Democrats know how to handle money for the benefit of all and not one side or the other!!!!!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NCProgressive

(1,315 posts)
15. Yes ... and the loan was above market rates with stock as collateral
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 06:01 PM
Mar 2020

We made money from those loans.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Peacetrain

(23,627 posts)
21. Precisely!!! NC.. the republicans throw money down a rabbit hole
Tue Mar 17, 2020, 10:53 AM
Mar 2020

and throw us into such a debt crisis that they then try and blame us for the poor fiscal management they do..

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
13. Yes he did... and there's always some excuse or justification.
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 05:52 PM
Mar 2020

It makes me sick.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
20. For people that are basically ideologues, they will find SOMETHING wrong
Mon Mar 16, 2020, 06:40 PM
Mar 2020

with even the best legistlation.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»Democratic Primaries»Bernie voted against the ...