The Way Forward
Related: About this forumIs it okay to discuss here what is NOT the way forward?
I appreciate that this forum has somewhat relaxed rules to encourage serious discussion on the essential questions of how we, as Democrats, must try to grab the wheel and turn this nation back onto a sane course.
Does that include being able to speak freely about what Democrats should obviously not be doing?
I hope so, because here goes...
These past weeks, Dems across the country (and not just here on DU) have been doing all they can to amplify the message that we must form a strong, united front against the work trump and his people are doing to crush our Democracy and actually de-legitimize our Constitution.
Even before they began nabbing people of color off the streets and filling detention camps with them, some of us were trying to shed light on the statements of some elected Democrats who were sending counter-messaging that this nazi-based regime might be "worked with" in some way, that what they are doing, and what they are telling us they are planning to do, might be acceptable in some way. We responded as loudly as we could against the "yes" votes that were trickling in from Democratic Senators for the very nominees trump will entrust to bring down our governmental institutions.
With some hope, there was backlash, even the corporate media allowed aired segments to show how the will of the sane half of America was calling for resistance, opposition, and unity on the left. A handful of elected officials brought even more attention to the need for steady defiance in the face of "shock and awe" actions of this Administration.
And yet, after watching the devastation unfolding for weeks, today we wake up to this:
The vote was 79-18. More than half of Senate Democrats joined all 53 Republicans in voting for Burgum.
https://apnews.com/article/burgum-trump-interior-secretary-energy-a123dea9f2a1f03a1ed95f316593740d
We can not be normalizing trump's work.
We can not be sending the message to the public that any of his ideas, desires, or actions are acceptable.
We can not be pretending that any of this is "business as usual", because we know it isn't.
We can not become complicit in the undeniable (and undenied ) attempts to dismantle our Democracy.
...and yet that is EXACTLY what some elected Dems are doing every day this crucial week by accepting and agreeing with the people trump is putting in positions of power, authority, and control.
How deep exactly is the rot of America?
We must face hard realities right now.
Will what Democrats see in the mirror be one of the hardest to face?
Will we discover that WE are actually one of the most destructive realities, smoothing the way forward toward the end our 250 year old American Democracy?
WE CAN NOT continue to assist the current fascist regime to annihilate our Democracy.
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surfered
(4,742 posts)Walleye
(37,505 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)This idea that (only) Dems should be voting for-or-against depending on nomimee "qualifications" and not the nominee's intentions is absurd.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)LearnedHand
(4,442 posts)Why should Dems then "pick" their battles? How's that working out currently? This bullshit never has worked and never will.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)...and fight it appropriately.
Voltaire2
(15,162 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Exactly what benefit do the Dems who vote yes see in weakening America's resolve to fight against fascism???
Voltaire2
(15,162 posts)Remember that under our political system these federal legislators are almost all utterly dependent on big money donors, and are instructed by 'consultants' as to how to behave correctly in order to get the money they need to run their next campaign.
Then there is this decades long 'third way'/ 'democratic leadership committee' ideology that is pervasive in the party that political success requires 'capturing the center'. This is the legacy of the Clinton, Obama, and to a lesser extent Biden presidencies that rejects left economic populism (for example medicare for all), views itself as 'pro business' (supporting deregulation, for example), and grudgingly accommodates social issues in order to shore up support from the left.
Since the emergence of Trump and the more or less acknowledged failure of the neoliberal economic system, this position has simply been reduced to defending institutional traditions from the past (e.g. 'bipartisanship') in the face of a radical fascist Republican Party that is actively trying to destroy not only the traditions but the institutions themselves.
So we have the comic farce of centrist Democrats proudly boasting that they are reaching across the aisle 'to get things done', when the people they are reaching out to basically want them in prison or dead.
It is fucking infuriating.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Thank you.
LearnedHand
(4,442 posts)Wow indeed.
Polybius
(19,080 posts)He picked someone good, because he owed Teamster's Sean O'Brian a favor. She needs to get in.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Besides, trump doesn't pay back favors.
choie
(5,063 posts)that not one single Democrat will vote to confirm Patel, Gabbard or Kennedy, right?
Walleye
(37,505 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Keep Up The Noise!
Keep Up The Resistance!
Keep Up The Lawsuits!
Keep Up The Opposition!
IMPEACH!!!
Walleye
(37,505 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Passages
(1,752 posts)Then vote with them on legislation IF/WHEN its purpose yields to those we know need it the most.
These confirmation position votes are infuriating...a completely different matter.
Tell them the individual is unacceptable because they are!
Walleye
(37,505 posts)Even if we did try to work with them, they would twist it. Use it against us and we still wouldnt get the good legislation. I will believe this until I see otherwise
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)...the confusing part is that the Dems know this (or should know it by now) and still they risk normalizing this entire situation by voting "yes", knowing full-well the nominees will probably get in anyway.
The question is, WHY are they normalizing this by voting yes?
Passages
(1,752 posts)populist promises, use legislation to call him on it. It would have to be written to help who he said it should help.
One, if there is no such legislation, we shout from the rooftops how he reneged on that campaign promise.
If the GOP ever writes up legislation that addresses lower drug costs in any way that intentionally undermines it in any fashion, we shout that out and campaign on delivering what Americans need.
I don't see saying no across the board as helpful to the American people, and in turn, it hurts Democrats.
Walleye
(37,505 posts)I just think we have to realize with Trump. Were not dealing with a rational mind, and the Republicans are not trustworthy at all.
Passages
(1,752 posts)But we still have to deal with them to beat them.
Walleye
(37,505 posts)But that bill was not one as a Democrat I would have supported.
When we go to the right, voters end up going with the truer Republican. Wasn't it Truman who warned about that?
Trump proved he has control over his party so I don't see how we gained anything having such harsh policies in the first place.
I believe we have allowed the GOP to frame us and immigrants as evil with lies for a very long time. I wish we used a very different approach...like the truth.
Tax Payments by Undocumented Immigrants ITEP
itep.org
https://itep.org undocumented-immigrants-taxes-2024
by C Davis · Cited by 4 Undocumented immigrants paid $96.7 billion in federal, state, and local taxes in 2022. Providing access to work authorization for ...
msfiddlestix
(7,972 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Passages
(1,752 posts)You started a great conversation.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)modrepub
(3,696 posts)It has to be done.
I sat in line for 2+ hours voting last November. I live in a Red area and there were plenty of folks in Trump garb, including flags on their shinny clean trucks. They were so happy to be voting for their man who was going to right all the wrongs. It seemed many of them had little to no experience voting; some were unsure if they were in the right polling place. Low engaged voters. My heart sank, I knew my state (PA) was probably going over to Trump.
I've had many arguments with my family and friends about how strongly to oppose Trump's policies and appointees. And I recognize there's a chance these folks are going to take steps to institutionalize Republican control into the future. But, Trump won the election. I don't believe in conspiracies or voter suppression. I saw the marginally engaged voters who IMHO put Trump into office with my own eyes. So be it; Trump has a right to put his people in positions of power not matter how incompetent they are (and boy, some of them sure are).
Will we suffer under Trump and his minions? It's early, the book is still being written. Personally, I believe Trump is a train wreck, dumpster fire, and whatever catastrophic analogy you want to insert. He's a royal fuck up.
But elections have consequences and we need to continue to point out Trump's utter incompetency and every time he screws up. He has to own it and we have to make sure he owns it. That means holding the M$M to it also. It sucks we're all going to have to suffer. But sometimes you just have to take it to demonstrate to folks what poor decisions they have made and hope they do better next time.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)"Will we suffer under Trump and his minions? It's early, the book is still being written."
I believe this is a situation where we don't have the luxury of waiting to see exactly how badly it turns out before we try to stop it from turning out badly.
Walleye
(37,505 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Polybius
(19,080 posts)Biden got 306 EV's. Trump in 2024 got 312.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)It's obvious that the Democratic party needs to focus our attention on important races at election times.
Voltaire2
(15,162 posts)People here in this country are already suffering from this fascist regime. I guess they are invisible to you or not part of whatever this 'we' is.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Callie1979
(517 posts)There was a good reason I put in my post.
Callie1979
(517 posts)Passages
(1,752 posts)Neoliberalism doesn't remedy the ills of unbridled capitalism and it never will. What it did accomplish was manifest fertile ground for a demagogue to win, twice.
Our losses:
Obama was elected in 2008, Democratic Party lost a total of 15 state houses chambers, 14 state senate chambers, 960 state legislative seats, 10 governorships, 62 seats in Congress, and 11 seats in the Senate.
How Neoliberalism Failed, and What a Better Society Could Look Like
August 7, 2024
By Joseph Stiglitz
SNIP
Power
Under neoliberalism, what was really going on was not a liberalization agenda, it was a rewriting-of-the-rules agenda6rewriting the rules in ways that advantaged some groups and disadvantaged others. Rewriting the rules is political. Its about power. The economic model that underlaid neoliberalism was one with perfect markets, with competitive equilibrium in which no one had power, meaning that neoliberalism began with a view that power doesnt exist. It began with that idea as a presumption, and with that belief allowed concentrated centers of power to flourish. Financial liberalization led to the unfettered growth of the financial sector, which became a major center of power in the American economy.
https://rooseveltinstitute.org/publications/how-neoliberalism-failed/
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)58Sunliner
(5,167 posts)What is this BS about picking battles??!! It's all a battle. They are at war against democracy and the US. When at war don't give an inch. If we don't take to the streets, we the people will have nothing left. We can not sit back and wait for leaders. They are apparently ok with that slippery slope sliding into fascism.
Walleye
(37,505 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)...complacency equals complicity.
Walleye
(37,505 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Paladin
(29,330 posts)Democrats and their elected representatives need to be fighting, right now. Pointed messages to politicians, economic boycotts, street demonstrations---immediately. The time for subtlety and nuanced measures has disappeared during the course of trump's first few days in office. We need decisive action just as soon as possible. I'm not ready to cede control of this nation to the brain-dead fascists. Enough.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Nanjeanne
(5,563 posts)together and saying THIS IS NOT RIGHT AND WE DEMAND BETTER.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)yardwork
(65,359 posts)It's been 50 years of this crap from Republicans and they e taken us to the brink.
WAKE UP, Chuck Schumer, Hakeem Jeffries, and the rest of you.
STOP:
- sending fundraising texts begging me for $5 instead of telling me what you're doing to fight.
- voting for Trump's nominees. If this situation were reversed, Republican senators would be voting against every single nominee - and they'd be obstructing procedures and delaying votes in any way possible. Why isn't Schumer doing this???
- sending texts with bizarre statements about "the Lord is on his Throne." I don't believe that. It's not remotely a comfort to me. That text from Jeffries literally scared me.
- saying namby pamby things to the media that frame Trump as something kind of cute and weird instead of AN IMMEDIATE THREAT TO OUR DEMOCRACY.
I've never felt so frightened and angry.
Walleye
(37,505 posts)yardwork
(65,359 posts)The DNC should pay attention to that. A lifelong Democrat is deleting my own party's emails and reporting them as junk.
WAKE UP.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)Are they just so comfortable and safe that they think this is all fine?
What will it take to make them hear us?
Callie1979
(517 posts)That alone isnt a legit reason to deny him. He's NOT Gaetz, Kennedy or Hegseth (among others)
He's a Governor so there's management experience.
He started a business in clean tech & life sciences
He started other successful businesses
He's far more qualifed to be president than TRUMP is.
Think. Again.
(21,382 posts)...his intention to drag the department backward by promoting obsolete energy technology is enough to deny him.
Annd yes, the fact that a destructive fascist President picked him is DEFINITELY enough reason not to lend Democratic Party support and legitimacy to his regime.
jalan48
(14,653 posts)Eddie Haskell 60
(18 posts)Funding deadline is coming up on March 14th, 2025. Democrats MUST reject all proposals until we return to acceptable Constitutional norms. Although Republicans are likely to shutdown government on their own, this is one of the last areas where the Democratic party will have any impacts. Yes, people will be financially hurt but messaging and facts are clearly not getting to the American people. Hit them in their pocketbooks and maybe they'll start listening and paying attention.