Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Cirsium

(3,274 posts)
35. Who cares?
Wed Apr 2, 2025, 04:49 PM
Apr 2025

Who cares? And what difference does it make? News outlets love this dementia stuff, people who are in denial and are hoping that somehow MAGA will just magically fade away without a fight love this.

I don't look to "prominent psychologists and psychiatrists" for political analysis. The prominent this that and the other people have been AWOL, asleep at the wheel, or we would not be dealing with MAGA.

To get a doctor’s take on the issue, MDLinx reached out to multiple neurologists and other doctors for their insights. Many of HCPs, however, replied saying that they felt uncomfortable or unequipped to comment on Trump’s health.


What do we find when we ask doctors?

"Trump’s actions in Philly are being described as impulsive and abrupt, which some experts suggest is a sign of cognitive decline."

"Some have been hinting that Trump has been experiencing mental or physical alarm for the last few months."

The first thing one notices about the text itself is the title The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump. It is ambiguous but not innocent. When a doctor speaks of a case, the term references a clinical case in which a person becomes a patient, with a history, symptoms, laboratory findings, medical conditions, and a life lived in a community, but here in the title of the book sits one of the key disputed points: the psychiatrist has to deny that Mr. Trump's case is one of a patient while simultaneously providing a diagnosis that is claimed not to be a diagnosis; otherwise, all the Hippocratic and legal, medical, and ethics-related problems arise: confidentiality, privacy, respect, beneficence, nonmaleficence, and some sort of mutual contract. So, if he is not a patient, which he is not, in what sense is he a “case,” and why is the term used in the title of the book? It is left unclear, purposely, I assume. If there was any doubt that convening a conference that assesses the mental health of a president and publishing a book of the papers given at the conference sticks a finger in the eye of the APA leadership, then the labeling of President Trump as a case throws down the gauntlet.

There are three sections to this book. The first, entitled “The Trump Phenomenon,” takes up questions of diagnoses. The second section, entitled “The Trump Dilemma,” should really be titled “The Psychiatrists' Dilemma.” Trump has no dilemma; psychiatry does. This section discusses the problem that psychiatry has in deciding what stance to take about his dangerousness, especially in light of the Goldwater Rule. The third section, “The Trump Effect,” examines the impact of his personality and policies on various segments of the population (often white middle-class citizens in therapy) and on the psychiatric profession.

However, our appreciation for the courage and effort to take on the APA ethics police and the Trump lobby should not cause us to overlook some of the weaknesses in arguments, logic, perspective, and evidence. I recognize the pressures to get this book out in a timely fashion, but an index would have been helpful. It is difficult to go back and forth and see what several of the authors had to say about narcissism or dangerousness or the Goldwater Rule. On a more substantial note, there is too often a lack of critical thinking about concepts and causality, which seriously weakens the credibility of what the authors wish to get across. For example, there are too many outdated and simplistic assumptions about the psychodynamics of narcissism. The reader is told that persons are narcissistic to hide their shame or overcompensate for their inadequacies; they stifle their conscience and their compassion. I do not know if any of these generalizations are true of Mr. Trump, nor do I have confidence that if I asked him directly, I would get a trustworthy answer. It does not help the advancement of our field to proffer rote explanations, and it certainly does not help to use such arguments in trying to persuade anyone to view the situation differently.

Moving on, the lack of critical thinking and the presence of inexact comparisons are distressing. Is it helpful to call Presidents Clinton and Kennedy narcissists, because they are said by some to be womanizers? How many women does one have to be casually involved with to be a womanizer? Is it the number or quality of relationships that supports such a label? Would the APA come down on psychiatrists as heavily if they called a political figure they had not personally examined a womanizer rather than a narcissist? Are there reasons, other than narcissism, to consider why an individual might be a womanizer?

https://jaapl.org/content/46/2/267


As you know, it can be challenging to diagnose a patient with a health condition when they are not, in fact, your patient, and when they haven’t visited you in your office or talked to you during a telehealth or face-to-face appointment. It can be even harder to make a medical evaluation based on secondhand information, social media feeds, or news reports.

https://www.mdlinx.com/article/doctors-react-to-claims-that-trump-is-sundowning/4rPDR0lIEHfW8euPL4EZNS

Recommendations

1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

With an exemption for Don JR's dealer. jls4561 Apr 2025 #1
Well, if anyone still needed proof that he's insane, there it is. Dave Bowman Apr 2025 #2
Of course the fentanyl dealers will declare their imports at the border Ocelot II Apr 2025 #3
Mafia Don just wants his cut from the illegal drug trade. sop Apr 2025 #4
He's an idiot JoseBalow Apr 2025 #5
He's an idiot that doesn't know that he's an idiot. SammyWinstonJack Apr 2025 #20
Unfortunately for the rest of us, that's the worst kind JoseBalow Apr 2025 #24
And I never thought he'd have a good idea! Hard to collect on but heck of a concept. dutch777 Apr 2025 #6
The stupid motherfucker Aviation Pro Apr 2025 #7
Even If You're Correct... ProfessorGAC Apr 2025 #10
What???? This makes no sense at all TommieMommy Apr 2025 #8
How dumb does he think his base is? subterranean Apr 2025 #9
He absolutely knows how dumb his base is. He plays them like a harp. It's allegorical oracle Apr 2025 #25
I don't think he means he's putting tariffs on fentanyl. Qutzupalotl Apr 2025 #11
That's probably it - Trump's usual garbled rhetoric. Disaffected Apr 2025 #21
I saw another clip and he definitely said tariffs on fentanyl. yardwork Apr 2025 #22
You're giving him way to much credit... Wiz Imp Apr 2025 #29
This message was self-deleted by its author Qutzupalotl Apr 2025 #37
The *value*, not the drug itself. Qutzupalotl Apr 2025 #41
Nope Wiz Imp Apr 2025 #42
It's just a cover story. Qutzupalotl Apr 2025 #44
Trump is now speaking in his native language: Imbecilish. Ping Tung Apr 2025 #12
"Imbecilish" needs to be designated as the officiial language of MAGA. sop Apr 2025 #14
For the common MAGAs it will be limited to words with no more than 5 letters. Ping Tung Apr 2025 #15
Trump operates like mob boss. He wants a cut from traffickers delisen Apr 2025 #13
"Are you bringing any valuable items into the United States Aristus Apr 2025 #16
Maybe he can collect tariffs from the coyotes who bring yellowcanine Apr 2025 #17
Trump is showing more signs of his senility LetMyPeopleVote Apr 2025 #18
The method to the madness Cirsium Apr 2025 #19
I agree. This is all scripted. yardwork Apr 2025 #23
Thanks Cirsium Apr 2025 #31
Sorry, but there are numerous prominent psychologists and psychiatrists who Wiz Imp Apr 2025 #30
Both can be true. yardwork Apr 2025 #33
Who cares? Cirsium Apr 2025 #35
What's baffling is that anyone believes Trump is sane Raven123 Apr 2025 #26
Why? Cirsium Apr 2025 #36
Just put a toll booth up at Elon's house. C_U_L8R Apr 2025 #27
Donald, go directly to the smugglers and dealers. Norrrm Apr 2025 #28
he is our buffoon RANDYWILDMAN Apr 2025 #32
CIA rumored to generate $ through dope. Enjoy your stay trump. GreenWave Apr 2025 #34
Well, Afghanistan got more favourable treatment on his big chart than any other country Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2025 #38
I guess he forgot that it's an illegal market Meowmee Apr 2025 #39
That does actually fit the way he's decide tariffs - the more imports from a country, the higher the tariffs muriel_volestrangler Apr 2025 #40
Not the Onion Hekate Apr 2025 #43
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»'Mad king': Trump baffles...»Reply #35