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DFW

(60,923 posts)
71. At first, neither did I, but it soon became clear
Mon Jul 6, 2026, 01:13 AM
Monday

The higher up they were, the more likely they were to have traveled abroad, and met with a variety of foreigners, including even some Cuban exiles. The government official that invited me was a guy I had met at a conference in London. I had lived in Spain and majored in Spanish in college. I never even found out how this guy’s English was. We spoke only Spanish from the minute we met. Some of the limousine riders spoke passable Russian from having received “political training” in Brezhnev’s Soviet Union, but it was mostly just Spanish.

If you travel and get to speak with people you are not likely to meet at home, you will be exposed to other ideas, other media. Ordinary Cubans couldn’t do that. High government officials could. They cherished their privileges dearly, but they did not lock themselves in their hotel rooms at night to read from Marx and Engels. They read newspapers out of Spain, and talked with people from around the world. They knew what was going on.

To have gotten as far as they did, they had to have been true believers in the beginning. Otherwise, they never would have risen as high as they did in the party’s hierarchy. But with contact with the world outside the Soviet empire came awareness and contact with people who were not limited to saying only what they were told to say and hearing only what they were told to hear. Their man that I met in London wore a suit that was more expensive than any I have ever worn in my life, although I was never one for “proper attire.” He had made it to the point where he was considered useful enough to the country to travel, and he made good use of his opportunity. He said that he absolutely considered himself a “socialista,” but in 1982 Cuba, no one who wanted to be more than a janitor couldn’t well say anything different.

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1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

He's right Fiendish Thingy Jul 2 #1
I have been saying this over and over for the 8 years (today is my 8 year anniversary) I have been on DU Celerity Jul 2 #16
Happy Anniversary SocialDemocrat61 Jul 2 #30
thanks so much Celerity Jul 2 #35
What's the difference? Farmer-Rick Jul 2 #17
It's more than semantics Fiendish Thingy Jul 2 #23
I agree AZProgressive Jul 2 #2
And, believe it or not, as president, Biden was the closest to a Keynesian since LBJ. Fiendish Thingy Jul 2 #24
Like when the Danish PM reminded someone that Denmark's a market economy, not socialist. betsuni Jul 2 #3
That reminds me of a quote from Tom Souzzi AZProgressive Jul 2 #7
These secret conspire & whine cocktail parties sound intriguing. betsuni Jul 2 #36
Oh, and same revolution person said attendees at such Democratic events are "older, whiter, and wealthier" betsuni Jul 3 #43
Not only that DFW Jul 3 #44
I forgot the canapes: "Some of the wealthiest members of the political establishment are hiding behind closed doors betsuni Jul 3 #57
When I hear canapes, I always think caviar, which I hate DFW Jul 3 #58
I love the Scandinavian smoked cod roe caviar that comes in tubes (any seafood-mayo or cheese in tubes). betsuni Jul 3 #61
I used to get this a lot in France in the 1960s, from many 18 year old experts on the USA who had never been there DFW Jul 3 #63
Interesting experiences! electric_blue68 Sunday #69
At first, neither did I, but it soon became clear DFW Monday #71
Interesting observations. electric_blue68 16 hrs ago #72
Norman Thomas, perennial socialist candidate, knew FDR was not a Socialist DBoon Jul 3 #59
More of us every day. BlueTsunami2018 Jul 2 #4
Socialism represents public power. Of course Emile Jul 2 #5
Absolutely, and, I'm tired of the bad faith false choice. Oneironaut Jul 2 #6
But MAGA morons believe Fox, and Trump, and SInclaire radio, NewsMax etc. They're dumb and hateful people ChicagoTeamster Jul 2 #8
Great, just please stop using the term "socialist." Say "Democrat." Period. Auggie Jul 2 #9
Doesn't matter SurfLiberal Jul 2 #10
That word can rally their troops. Like your idea -- stay home. Auggie Jul 2 #25
Doesn't mean you have to call yourself one Boo1 Jul 2 #26
Sorta like the Nordic model Joinfortmill Jul 2 #11
social democracy is a foundation for our Nordic Model (I am in Sweden) Celerity Jul 2 #13
The elephant in the room that is not being addressed here.. ananda Jul 2 #12
This message was self-deleted by its author applegrove Jul 2 #14
It is called liberalism in Canada. applegrove Jul 2 #15
The Liberal Party of Canada is not a social democratic party, the New Democratic Party is the social democratic party. Celerity Jul 2 #27
They could have had Polliviere Callie1979 Jul 3 #51
Economically, Carney is making multiple moves that are similar to what Poilievre would do, Celerity Jul 3 #54
Small "L" liberalism Fiendish Thingy Jul 2 #29
Used to be called that in the US, too. wnylib Jul 2 #37
Then the neocons took away the word liberal by making it derogatory. applegrove Jul 2 #38
I refused to have it taken from me. There is nothing wrong wnylib Jul 3 #41
Liberal and Socialist have been tainted by the Rs and their Big Media 31j20b3 Jul 2 #18
John Steinbeck quote anamnua Jul 2 #19
And that was many decades BEFORE Fox Noise. DFW Jul 3 #53
As soon as the Govt starts bailing out failed "free market" Capitalism, any argument against Govt social programs ToxMarz Jul 2 #20
Right you are. Tax breaks for corporations is just a direct applegrove Jul 2 #22
That's a consequence of financial deregulations that wnylib Jul 2 #39
Regulated capitalism saw capitalism as an economic tool. Capitlists seek to unleash it as a form of governance. ToxMarz Jul 3 #42
yup Skittles Jul 3 #45
It doesn't matter Cirsium Jul 2 #21
Too many FASCISTS in the U.S! Remember in WWII, it was the fascists who REALLY hated the socialists. eom Exp Jul 2 #28
In The Third Reich, they merged DFW Jul 3 #46
Absolutely. SamuelAdams Jul 2 #31
I have a confession to make SocialDemocrat61 Jul 2 #32
Same here. I have always said that I am a liberal Dem to the left of center, but wnylib Jul 3 #40
It gets complicated when you say As In Europe. DFW Jul 3 #47
Most American voters don't have that background understanding wnylib Jul 3 #55
Pretty sad when affordable day care, affordable rent, and affordable transportation are called "socialism". Bluetus Jul 2 #33
Sad and disingenuous as well. DFW Jul 3 #48
Krugman is tops BaronChocula Jul 2 #34
And the supposedly business-friendly Republicans cut Obama's business Stimulus package in half DFW Jul 3 #49
Scumbags BaronChocula Jul 3 #50
It is a mentality we will never understand, and they exploit that to the max DFW Jul 3 #52
"but they are grateful for our reluctance to do so" BaronChocula Jul 3 #60
I have run into Gingrich a few times, but never really talked to him. DFW Jul 3 #65
He's very wrong TVguyCards Jul 3 #56
I think most people voting for candidates to get universal applegrove Jul 3 #62
I wouldn't be so sure TVguyCards Jul 3 #64
"make the argument that workers should own the means of production" EX500rider Jul 3 #66
Ahh I was expecting you to say that :) TVguyCards Jul 3 #67
So the short answer is there have been no economically successful socialists countries? EX500rider Jul 3 #68
I can say back in NYC in the early 1970s there were some Socialists. I know because.... electric_blue68 Sunday #70
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