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Men's Group

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Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
Mon Dec 3, 2012, 12:21 AM Dec 2012

The rape threads point to a larger need...revolutionary change in what it is to be "a man". [View all]



We, as men, need to bring the old structure of "masculinity" down and build(to reclaim a phrase the Stalinists misused and unfairly discredited) a "new man" within its shell.

Rape is a product, more than anything else, I think, of the values that society prizes in men...the suppression of all emotions except anger, the fixation with "winning", the importance of asserting dominance at all cost, the refusal to accept "no" as an answer(because to do so would be taken as weakness)...and the way that those values cause corrode already damaged men and drive them to inflicting damage on others(including rape).

For rape, and for the other twisted results of the way manhood and masculinity has gone wrong to be stopped, the whole culture of masculinity has to be radically changed...and as many men as possible need to be part OF this change...both in our daily practice of life AND in the way in which we interact with other men.

There are other factors as well, and those who will post in this thread can add to the list and the causes.

I'm not sure when this work will be completed, but it has to start and it has to start now.

Until we can change the way we, as men, process emotions such as rage, frustration, fear and stress, create humane and respect-based power relations among ourselves, those who work for us/those we work for, those we live with/love/care about/spend time with, and those we are responsible for, there is little in life around us that can change...and massive change is needed in life it we're to survive and help others survive with us.

Don't know what all this will have to involve, but I'd like to start a long-time conversation in this thread and see what we can come up with-because we have to come up with something, and soon.

The way we live as men now causes far too many of us to harm others, whether through rape, violence, misuse of power, and inability to find ways to end powerlessness among ourselves and everyone we live with.

It's on us as men to make the changes within our gender.

Let's start now and see what we can do.

(NOTE: I posted this originally and GD and somebody said...not with entirely friendly intent, yet it struck me as an interesting idea nonetheless...that I should cross-post it here. Please send me links to related threads here where the discussion is going along these lines).
28 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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There are no gender ethics. There's just ethics. rrneck Dec 2012 #1
Thank you for the x-post. I'll reply more in the am when I'm on a real keyboard. nt lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #2
And yet... Bonobo Dec 2012 #3
Men and women are different...this is true. Ken Burch Dec 2012 #4
It's an easy call to make to distance yourself from those behaviors Major Nikon Dec 2012 #8
i have been fighting that for years on du. seabeyond Dec 2012 #7
I consider you one of the most reasonable people who post on HoF Major Nikon Dec 2012 #9
Yes, I know that and appreciate it. nt Bonobo Dec 2012 #12
I disagree that men, in general, need "repairing". Warren DeMontague Dec 2012 #5
Agree. Denninmi Dec 2012 #6
Most men don't rape and most men aren't violent and yet almost all rape and Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #13
Are you violent? Warren DeMontague Dec 2012 #14
Apparently none of us are violent and none of us are rapists and there is no problem Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #21
The degree to which the innocent can prevent the guilty from victimizing is limited. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #25
"Own up to it"? DavidDvorkin Dec 2012 #15
So what? Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #22
In Buddhism, true change begins by changing oneself. Bonobo Dec 2012 #24
There's only 4 people on this planet for whom I am responsible in this way. opiate69 Dec 2012 #16
"We" aren't owning up to anything.. Upton Dec 2012 #17
Besides gender, are their other groups that need to own up for things? ProudToBeBlueInRhody Dec 2012 #18
Most muslims are not suicide bombers. Yet all suicide bombers are muslim. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #19
Muslims need to address jihadist violence within Muslim culture. Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #20
And what do you think -and be exact- that a middle-class Muslim in say, Sweden, Bonobo Dec 2012 #23
I'm sorry for my snippy response in the other thread. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #10
I've also been living on the West Coast for a long time, I just don't see the cultural rigidity Warren DeMontague Dec 2012 #11
Yeah, but it's a much bigger issue than rape... TreasonousBastard Dec 2012 #26
Unchanged. lumberjack_jeff Dec 2012 #27
6th gonzo_del_oeste Dec 2012 #28
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