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Feminists
In reply to the discussion: group host / statement of purpose [View all]Remember Me
(1,532 posts)183. Me too
And that paragraph is:
But at the end of the day - I know in THIS group I can share the personal in the political from the perspective of a woman who has to compete EVERY SINGLE DAY in the good old boys club and that I can get support for Equal Pay For Women . . . Not lesbian, straight, latina, Korean, bi-racial, caucasian, etc. etc. wome - but WOMEN. And if that is not one's allegiance - i.e. identifying inequities and trying to discuss how we can make even the tiniest of personal changes to give EVERY woman a fair shake regardess of race, religion, sexuality, socio-economic status - then I'd say one is not here to discuss feminist issues.
Here's what I don't get in the "allegiance wars," I'll call them.
WHY!!??!!????
What is there to choose allegiance over or about? That's the mystery to me. How divisive is that? There should be nothing to choose allegiance over in any regard, for any of these groups. In the feminism I know and embrace, there IS no choosing necessary: all is for all, and even the benefits to women don't come at the expense of men (though loss of male privilege is often seen as very expensive, but it's an unearned reward and therefore an unfair benefit and immoral if it serves to keep women oppressed.)
And the same goes for the other groups. THERE SHOULD BE NO CHOOSING ALLEGIANCES REQUIRED -- or desired. Anyone who sees the need -- or advantage -- of pitting groups against one another or choosing among them is operating from a seriously flawed set of operating principles. My oppression as a white middle class female is just as important as yours if you're black female, just as important as yours if you're a black male. Your oppression as a gay male of whatever color is just as important -- and intrinsically tied to -- my oppression. There is no group you can name whose oppression is MORE IMPORTANT than mine, or LESS IMPORTANT than mine because it is ALL OF ONE PIECE, even if there are different manifestations of it.
The feminism I know and embrace understands that, embraces that, teaches that. WHAT KIND OF FEMINISM DOESN'T???? I can't tell you how many times I carried those round purple N.O.W. signs against racism, in favor of gay rights, pro-choice... it's all of a piece, people and IMO the feminism I know and embrace, with its healthy dose of Marxist analysis, holds the key to unlocking the oppression for ALL the world's oppressed peoples, no matter what their color, shape, gender, sexual orientation or affinity, etc.
I would suggest that anyone feeling a need for "choosing" either do some heavy duty inner reflection on what is the split they are feeling internally in order to do some persona l haling, and/or do or seek some analysis about feminism and how they can rise above the apparent dichotomy they are feeling or sensing to see the unity, or a way to achieve unity in their goals and aspirations without having to "choose" allegiances, if that makes any sense.
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I object to limiting discussion to just today. There are many DUers who don't visit forums daily,
Gormy Cuss
Jan 2012
#7
Then may we please start over with just a discussion of the SoP and try to get consensus on that?
Gormy Cuss
Jan 2012
#10
I've been around this group for a very long time and I've seen many serious disputes
Gormy Cuss
Jan 2012
#22
It either needs to explicitly limit the statement to discussing those things outside of a feminist
Gormy Cuss
Jan 2012
#27
are you lgbtq? if so you get to decide who is and who is not a homophobe
La Lioness Priyanka
Jan 2012
#37
actually i do think its gender not sex. transwomen for instance, imo belong to the feminist movement
La Lioness Priyanka
Jan 2012
#41
you came into this thread of over 300 posts and made ONE. one post. on mine. it was a jab and you
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#46
i was having a blast at the dinner table tonight talking about all the many groups
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#110
As a lesbian and someone who considers herself a feminist, I have a comment on all this back & forth
justiceischeap
Jan 2012
#52
You can't put the definition of feminism in a box ... but it seems like some can with people
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#54
I think it is a matter of acknowledging whatever privilege one might bear in a conversation or
Starry Messenger
Jan 2012
#62
find one post, ONE post i have not worked at, struggled with to hear the other side. ONE.
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#69
but we are not demanding the same. it CAN NOT be just one sided. we cannot say we are putting in
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#72
that is the point. the whole point i have been arguing from post ONE. sides. we have the GD sides
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#82
and i KNOW why you felt people were picking sides. and i know you are trying your best to be
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#105
of course that is a factor. nor have i ever denied any of that nor been unwilling to discuss.
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#68
I am also speaking globally as a reply in the subthread to justiceischeap's post.
Starry Messenger
Jan 2012
#75
so... because i am a middle aged women i should readily accept i am a prude, anti sex, asexual,
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#76
so, not only do i have to listen to all these demeaning comments over and over and over from the men
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#78
i ahve asked a couple times how it needs to be worded. i dont care. i havent heard anyone put a
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#91
thank you for talking to me like a person, instead of a caricature. i think that is what i was
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#86
gormy? can you find any posts where this other side (since i have been put on a side i dont want)
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#70
seabeyond, I've argued repeatedly over the first bullet point because I believe it was and is
Gormy Cuss
Jan 2012
#77
i ahev to agree with iverglas. you guys are saying that lioness has issues. i dont get what they
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#90
how do you want it worded so you are comfortable with you. i want your whole body in, not just a
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#96
"I am simply one of many who has had too much of being attacked, and not engaged."
justiceischeap
Jan 2012
#99
do we need to start fresh with a new thread and put this one behind. someone type the SOP,
seabeyond
Jan 2012
#87
Where is this "let's all get along spirit"? How ironic you've forgotten what thread this is.
CreekDog
Feb 2012
#117
Are you serious? I use the phrase 'to call a spade a spade' all the time...
Violet_Crumble
Feb 2012
#118
there is NO racial connotation in the term. YOU are creating one. but that is not the facts. nt
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#134
tar baby is and has always been, hands down, a racist term derived as a derogatory
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#157
yes. it is. that is why i didnt use it. and then i did research on spade for spade because of
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#144
yet FACT would argue what some people think. but, i recognize we have had this discussion on our
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#152
and now in other news ... well they ain't gonna have iverglas to kick around for a while!
iverglas
Feb 2012
#178
Depending on where you live, yes, "to call a spade a spade" would have racial overtones
justiceischeap
Feb 2012
#127
we understand. if you will google the saying, you would know that spade for spade was established
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#132
Well, it's a common turn of phrase here in Australia and has been for ages...
Violet_Crumble
Feb 2012
#171
calling her a bigot for saying spade a spade. the hostility of your post. false claims
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#125
another point. not about objectionable pageant because every person that had issue stated FIRST
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#151
Well I am one person (but I guess you're saying my opinion doesn't count as your ONE DUer)
CreekDog
Feb 2012
#161
No, but turning up just to have a go at a member of this group sure is...
Violet_Crumble
Feb 2012
#172
ummm..... you really did not read iverglas's posts before going into your rant and criticism?
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#130
you didnt address the accusation of bigotry with pearl clutching. you didnt address the people in
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#163
do you have any intention of participating for the group according to the group's stated purpose
seabeyond
Feb 2012
#149
of course I am following the rules and as host, if this discussion is against them
CreekDog
Feb 2012
#159
Point me to the rule that says it's okay to appear out of the blue and abuse a member of this group.
Violet_Crumble
Feb 2012
#173