Gun Control & RKBA

Nuclear Unicorn

(19,497 posts)

97. If someone, without provocation, threatened me with grave injury or death would I

Reply to guillaumeb (Reply #93)

Thu Sep 1, 2016, 06:54 PM

Sep 2016

be justified in using deadly force to protect myself?

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131 replies

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Yup, it's officially a moral panic: [View all] friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 OP

Not really surprised at the crying Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #1

Should have provided a trigger-warning to the class. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #2

Nice! Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #10

A site to explore: guillaumeb Aug 2016 #3

How many were on a campus? Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #4

"I bet the percentage is actually quite miniscule." It is - see post #5 friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #6

I know, that poster Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #7

Check out the site. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #8

And once again, 2/3 are suicides Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #9

How many murders are committed by someone who then commits suicide? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #11

I expect much less than single suicide. Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #16

And no good is done by attemting to discuss murder in context of small sub-groups guillaumeb Aug 2016 #19

2/3 of the deaths you cite are suicide, not homicide. nt Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #24

The 30,000 dead remain dead. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #43

This context-free burbling re. '30,000 dead' is a good example of why you're failing. pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #48

"30,000 dead" in this case is a 'thought-terminating cliche': friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #64

Yes. Yes it is. pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #65

To be polite; "Overly Simplistic" applies DonP Aug 2016 #70

You are correct, of course, Don........ pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #77

We should catalog Thought-terminating cliches. One of the ones I notice most in GD is Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #68

We need a new thread for that but: discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2016 #69

Since I have to comb through GD for gun posts, it shouldn't be a surprise. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #71

"The nutters will be along any minute now to explain this away." pablo_marmol Aug 2016 #78

Except suicide is not murder Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #42

The 30,000 dead remain dead. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #44

2/3 by their own choice Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #46

Not only that but they remain deader than those who... discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2016 #49

i agree beergood Aug 2016 #54

That would be a larger topic, but we were speaking of "death by gun". guillaumeb Aug 2016 #55

so your saying beergood Aug 2016 #56

I already answered your question. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #57

"And this IS a gun group. Perhaps you should post on this topic." beergood Sep 2016 #117

My shooting is confined to one gun at this point. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #119

"Do you hunt also?" beergood Sep 2016 #120

It sounds like one of these. oneshooter Sep 2016 #121

forgive my ignorance beergood Sep 2016 #122

Definitions oneshooter Sep 2016 #123

thanks beergood Sep 2016 #124

No problem. oneshooter Sep 2016 #125

whats it like beergood Sep 2016 #126

Since I am a traditional shooter I shoot mainly Flint. Locks with PRB. oneshooter Sep 2016 #128

I do not hunt any longer. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #127

Where do you see that? Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #14

The attempt by some gun enthusiasts to divide gun owners into guillaumeb Aug 2016 #21

Attempt by some banners to apply Orwell to the King's English. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #26

Ahh, gotcha. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #27

Just as all car owners are responsible for traffic deaths. friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #20

None of the objects mentioned are designed specifically to kill. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #22

But they *do* kill on occasion. Are those killed by cars and drugs less dead than shooting victims? friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #25

Using the standard in #19, no. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #28

Is killing absolutely bad? Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #31

What if you were the target? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #51

You're evading. What if I was the target? Would using deadly force to stop that person be bad? Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #52

You asked originally if killing was bad. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #53

"Unanswerable with no context." Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #59

Self defense is a concept that I believe in. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #60

Fine words, indeed- but they do not answer the question asked. Here it is again: friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #62

Particular cases do not have bearing on a right. Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #66

That "right" is an inextricable part of the case. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #73

Oh nonsense. beevul Aug 2016 #75

The claim that Zimmerman exercised a right has no bearing to anyone outside of the case. Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #76

Yes it was self defense gejohnston Aug 2016 #79

Is this the official NRA fairy story version of the murder of Trayvon Martin? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #80

It is the objective facts and evidence presented at trial gejohnston Aug 2016 #81

Objective facts has nothing to do with this. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #82

Objective facts have everything to do with it gejohnston Aug 2016 #83

He baited you and you took it. Nuclear Unicorn Aug 2016 #84

go figure gejohnston Aug 2016 #85

So poor George Zimmerman is actually the victim in all this? guillaumeb Sep 2016 #86

The character of persons in particular cases have no bearing on rights in other cases friendly_iconoclast Sep 2016 #87

Zimmerman was looking for an excuse to use his gun. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #88

Wow! That's a pretty "creative" interpretation of the actual evidence and testimony DonP Sep 2016 #89

Creative writing, or the NRA rewriting history? guillaumeb Sep 2016 #92

So the NRA rewrote the court records? DonP Sep 2016 #94

Oh wise man, you forgot your link. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #95

No, what I forgot is that gun control fans are lazy as well as cheap DonP Sep 2016 #96

You made a specific allegation. You have refused to back it up. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #111

So, we'll add "not the sharpest pencil in the drawer" to lazy and cheap DonP Sep 2016 #112

More evasion and avoidance. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #113

If I'm attacked without provocation and fear grave bodily injury do I have a right to Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #114

Yes. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #115

You need to be provided evidence that courts keep records? N/T beevul Sep 2016 #116

Way, way too much like work, ... easier to rely on cartoons for your opinions DonP Sep 2016 #118

Thats your opinion. beevul Sep 2016 #90

For the sake of argument, let us concede that your estimate of him is correct. friendly_iconoclast Sep 2016 #91

No, it does not. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #93

If someone, without provocation, threatened me with grave injury or death would I Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #97

Of course NOT!!! oneshooter Sep 2016 #99

I wish my other interlocutor would answer the question. He's made a point to answer so many other Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #100

I think you scare him. n/t oneshooter Sep 2016 #103

I can't imagine anyone less imposing than me. Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2016 #106

But.....but.....but............. pablo_marmol Sep 2016 #109

Nor are they specifically designed to defend oneself. Straw Man Aug 2016 #47

30,000 misrepresented statistics. JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #34

You are denying difference in circumstances, which prevents effective action to prevent those deaths krispos42 Sep 2016 #129

If poverty and social inequality are the primary causes of crime. guillaumeb Sep 2016 #130

Thank you krispos42 Sep 2016 #131

A fisking of that site that will give the doctrinaire a sad: friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #5

30,000 gun deaths a year. Keep parsing and explaining. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #12

Your collective guilt-tripping and appeals to emotion seem not to be gaining traction friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #13

A certain number of people literally do not care about others. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #17

And those individual people are responsible, not an entire group friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #23

Yes. Some of them focus on what other people own. beevul Aug 2016 #33

30,000 gun dead are also the consequences of choices. guillaumeb Aug 2016 #35

Not my choices. N/T beevul Aug 2016 #36

I agree - at least 2/3 are in that example...suicide and all. Guess most are in fact, as others jmg257 Aug 2016 #41

I suppose the only way to show care is a gun ban? ileus Aug 2016 #45

"A certain number of people literally do not care about others." beergood Sep 2016 #98

Remarkable few of which were caused by by the group under discussion friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #15

What is the source of the electricity? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #18

A thoughtful reply to a question not asked- and I should have said CNG vehicles, not electric ones friendly_iconoclast Aug 2016 #29

If you had specified CNG, I would have responded: guillaumeb Aug 2016 #37

Isn't it a sad commentary virginia mountainman Aug 2016 #39

This message was self-deleted by its author JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #30

532 people have been killed by police so far this year. JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #32

Are you suggesting disarming the police? guillaumeb Aug 2016 #38

Except the police aren't covered by the Second Amendment. JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #40

Interesting - 885 total permit-related gun deaths in 9 years... jmg257 Aug 2016 #58

Now estimated at 14 million permits, not counting constitutional carry states DonP Aug 2016 #61

Indeed so Duckhunter935 Aug 2016 #63

While around 1200 criminals are responsible for over 400 deaths in Chicago alone every year. jmg257 Aug 2016 #67

There has been very little comment from the other TX colleges. Hangingon Aug 2016 #50

In UT lit classes, the study of Long Dong Silver is required. Eleanors38 Aug 2016 #72

Our Flagship university! Hangingon Aug 2016 #74

This message was self-deleted by its author apcalc Sep 2016 #101

What ought to be done until concealed carry is revoked: no_hypocrisy Sep 2016 #102

In most states that is already the law. Duckhunter935 Sep 2016 #104

Great idea, we can call that sort of action... SQUEE Sep 2016 #105

Along with about 40+ or so other states DonP Sep 2016 #107

And they see no_hypocrisy in arguing from a position of ignorance........ pablo_marmol Sep 2016 #108

No, they really take great pride in not knowing things DonP Sep 2016 #110