Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Surf Fishing Guru

(115 posts)
15. Compliment and comment . . .
Tue Dec 28, 2021, 02:21 PM
Dec 2021

Awesome post.

The only thing I could add are on this statement:

post #13 by discntnt_irny_srcsm: Historically the line between standard military arms such as shoulder fired rockets and civilian semi-auto rifles and handguns has moved as to what is permissible/legal. A hundred years ago hardware stores sold Thompson submachine guns. That no longer happens. Case law and state and federal laws have clearly delineated civilian arms.


As you make clear the RKBA is an original, fully retained right; no aspect of the possession and use of the personal arms of the private citizen was ever conferred to he federal government (which is to say, never surrendered by the citizen, "We the People" ).

The obverse to that tenet is that "We the People", when empowering the federal government did surrender some specific limited powers over some arms, specifically the weapons of open, indiscriminate warfare. In the founding period private citizens owned warships, through the Constitution that power of citizens to maintain and sail a warship was conferred to Congress in Art I, §8, cl. 11; "Congress shall have the power: To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water".

I would argue the principle behind that grant of power is extended through the other (supreme / preemptive) war powers, and the power claimed by Congress to set the rules for the acquisition, possession and use of modern weapons of war like "shoulder fired rockets" (bazookas & RPG's) all the way up to NBC's, by private citizens, are legitimate.

The argument for blanket justification of the limits created by NFA-34 on machine guns, sawed-off shotguns, SBR's/AOW's, is weaker given Miller, but of course Heller diluted that with the elevation, if not making primary over military usefulness, the "common use" protection criteria.

YMMV . . .

I've never really understood the logic of banning standard capacity magazines. PTWB Dec 2021 #1
The problem with your reasoning is that it comes down to AndyS Dec 2021 #4
"Arms" bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #2
Are you saying that the 2nd amendment shouldn't cover modern arms? PTWB Dec 2021 #3
See? You're interpreting every bit as much as the courts must /nt bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #5
I was asking what you were trying to say. PTWB Dec 2021 #6
The authors listed freedom of speech, but didn't foresee computers, yagotme Dec 2021 #7
The Internet isn't mentioned in the Constitution, either. PTWB Dec 2021 #8
Shoulder fired rocket launchers and suicide bombers with backpacks are also bearing arms bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #9
And you can't falsely shout fire in a crowded movie theater. PTWB Dec 2021 #10
Thank you for phrasing that correctly. Dial H For Hero Dec 2021 #11
You're welcome. PTWB Dec 2021 #12
It's sad, though, that this verbiage came out of a terrible decision The Mouth Dec 2021 #16
A shoulder launched rocket would be fun to have/shoot, yagotme Jan 2022 #18
Responding here to the Founders intent. discntnt_irny_srcsm Dec 2021 #13
Compliment and comment . . . Surf Fishing Guru Dec 2021 #15
Thanks discntnt_irny_srcsm Dec 2021 #17
I consider this stay a concession . . . Surf Fishing Guru Dec 2021 #14
Vacated and sent back to the courts The Mouth Jul 2022 #19
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Gun Control & RKBA»(California) Large-capaci...»Reply #15