Interfaith Group

TM99

(8,352 posts)

82. We may not disagree as much as you think.

Mon Nov 17, 2014, 12:36 PM

Nov 2014

Some, not all, are worth the challenge and can change.

How then?

By pointing out some basic psychological realities. I am not doing in depth analysis on individuals. I agree that would be inappropriate. However, what I have shared it really anything that a layperson might read in a 12 Step book or a pop psychology book, namely that hurt and trauma lead to rage which is often displaced on those similar to the original source but are not the original source.

Until someone is willing to take responsibility for their rage and seek the source of the hurt directly, they do run the risk of displacing, being abusive & bullying, and of being intolerant and bigoted.

That is why I am OK with general analysis of a situation to attempt to bring about a chance for change.

Usually though I simply just have to put these types on Ignore.

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The deluded argument. [View all] hrmjustin Nov 2014 OP

I don't hold very much hope for finding common ground with such a narrow and judgmental POV NYC_SKP Nov 2014 #1

Yes! I think several who make this argument enjoy making it and don't care about any feelings they hrmjustin Nov 2014 #12

You have been known to make statements about the mental health of atheists. cbayer Nov 2014 #36

Actually, I think a review of my replies of that nature.... NYC_SKP Nov 2014 #44

I don't recall them exactly, but I am sure you are portraying the posts cbayer Nov 2014 #46

If I wanted to combat this argument ZombieHorde Nov 2014 #2

Thank you and welcome to the interfaith room my friend. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #13

I like this, but there is a potential flaw I would ask that you address. cbayer Nov 2014 #37

"Delusional is believing in something for which there is not evidence" ZombieHorde Nov 2014 #50

Elegant. rug Nov 2014 #54

That is generally the approach I take. cbayer Nov 2014 #56

"revert to a position that they are using delusional in a colloquial, not clinical, way" ZombieHorde Nov 2014 #63

Very interesting take on that. One I had not considered. cbayer Nov 2014 #64

Ah, yes, the colloquial definition, as opposed to the formal one Fortinbras Armstrong Nov 2014 #87

I don't feel any need to combat such arguments. It's merely an opinion, and No Vested Interest Nov 2014 #3

Part of me agrees because I know I can't change opinions. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #14

Simple question. bvf Nov 2014 #4

Yes, you are. rug Nov 2014 #5

He already took it back. There couldn't be any less good faith here. cbayer Nov 2014 #38

My point is that the once the deluded argument comes than we see the mentally ill argument hrmjustin Nov 2014 #8

So you agree that bvf Nov 2014 #31

Yes they are distinct but I will be honest and say I don't care for either argument. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #32

No, of course you don't. rug Nov 2014 #33

It would depend on how it is used el_bryanto Nov 2014 #10

I got the same feeling that there was at least one who made this mentally ill argument that would hrmjustin Nov 2014 #15

This is completely laughable. You have taken a very clear position on this question. cbayer Nov 2014 #34

It's a weak argument and boils down to simple name-calling. rug Nov 2014 #6

"A delusion is a psychiatric disorder caused by a biological process." AtheistCrusader Nov 2014 #7

I think you also have to acknowledge that some atheists are using the term el_bryanto Nov 2014 #11

Some may be. AtheistCrusader Nov 2014 #28

Some may be? Well i suppose the sins of ones own side are a lot harder to see. nt el_bryanto Nov 2014 #30

The only nonclinical definition is an insult. rug Nov 2014 #29

It is school yard stuff designed to hurt. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #16

This gets to the limits of an interfaith discussion el_bryanto Nov 2014 #18

I believe they should be able to say that as well but not in this room, lol. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #19

Well that's the limits of interfaith, as I stated above el_bryanto Nov 2014 #20

Yes this room is rather limiting in some ways but I kind if like that way. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #21

If you can't respect a belief you consider "wrong," okasha Nov 2014 #48

I am very friendly with a Sunni Muslim Fortinbras Armstrong Nov 2014 #88

I know there is no way to 'police' it but TM99 Nov 2014 #22

Comparing it to both delusion and mental illness i agree el_bryanto Nov 2014 #26

I still disagree. TM99 Nov 2014 #27

I think there is some relatively innocuous colloquial use of the term by some members. cbayer Nov 2014 #39

I'm going to have to disagree. okasha Nov 2014 #73

I totally agree that some people are completely disingenuous when they claim cbayer Nov 2014 #81

You took the words right off my fingertjps. okasha Nov 2014 #41

It is a purposeful button-pusher. TM99 Nov 2014 #9

Yeah I doubt that we can convince them they are wrong but we can always present the hrmjustin Nov 2014 #17

It is designed to be hurtful. TM99 Nov 2014 #23

yes it needs to be called out more. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #24

I want to clarify something here. cbayer Nov 2014 #40

I think we might have to disagree somewhat on this. TM99 Nov 2014 #42

I agree with everything you say in your first paragraph, except cbayer Nov 2014 #43

We just disagree that's all. TM99 Nov 2014 #61

I think it's ok for us to agree to disagree. cbayer Nov 2014 #62

We may not disagree as much as you think. TM99 Nov 2014 #82

I'm not going to pass judgement on what you are doing other than to cbayer Nov 2014 #83

I respect your position. TM99 Nov 2014 #85

I greatly value your participation here. I hope you know that. cbayer Nov 2014 #86

Thank you. I never doubted it. nt TM99 Nov 2014 #89

In a recent thread of the 14 posters who responded only three responded by saying Leontius Nov 2014 #45

Oh, it's definitely not a small subset of those that responded to that thread cbayer Nov 2014 #47

And do you "diagnose" that the very many people on this site skepticscott Nov 2014 #106

This thread was not about Republicans so there would be no need to mention them. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #107

Host notice that requires your attention. MADem Nov 2014 #108

I didn't read it that way at all... TreasonousBastard Nov 2014 #109

kick. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #25

Even though I take a tremendous amount of heat for it, I challenge it. cbayer Nov 2014 #35

I agree. okasha Nov 2014 #53

Earning brownie points. He'll be in like Flynn anytime. cbayer Nov 2014 #58

Following a well-trodden path. okasha Nov 2014 #65

Anyone advancing such a position is arguing in bad faith (ad hominem) and can't be Common Sense Party Nov 2014 #49

This message was self-deleted by its author bvf Nov 2014 #51

Believers are not deluded. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #52

Why is he still here? cbayer Nov 2014 #57

I will contact the other hosts immediately. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #60

I wouldn't have so much of an issue but it's a hit and run participation el_bryanto Nov 2014 #66

Absolutely right. And he'll score even more points when he is blocked from here. cbayer Nov 2014 #67

I fully expect to be barred bvf Nov 2014 #93

The first sign of intellectual want is simple name-calling. rug Nov 2014 #98

For the record BVF is banned from this room. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #99

Thank you. He'll be collecting his brownie points and getting his promotion soon. cbayer Nov 2014 #100

I hope it is over. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #101

Banning people is sometimes necessary, particularly cbayer Nov 2014 #102

Thanks. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #103

When they pull this tag-team stunt, okasha Nov 2014 #104

Thanks my friend. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #105

When somebody says that, you'll be the first to know. rug Nov 2014 #55

I think this post is not in keeping with the sop of this room and as a host I remind you that hrmjustin Nov 2014 #59

With all due respect, bvf Nov 2014 #68

I think it best to self delete. Your goat question was not appreciated here. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #69

Done. bvf Nov 2014 #70

This is not an open room. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #71

Noted in full. n/t. bvf Nov 2014 #76

Thank you. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #77

If you want to "argue" you need to go over to the Religion forum. MADem Nov 2014 #72

This is a support group bvf Nov 2014 #78

More of a discussion group where people share experiences and perspectives MADem Nov 2014 #79

You must feel very clever with that one. I hope you don't tire yourself patting yourself on the el_bryanto Nov 2014 #80

Support group? Nice. Is Atheists & Agnostics a support group as well? cbayer Nov 2014 #84

MADem's description, not mine. n/t. bvf Nov 2014 #90

Unless you are speaking of some post somewhere else, kentauros Nov 2014 #91

Thanks for the helpful links. bvf Nov 2014 #92

Well, I see that, no matter what, kentauros Nov 2014 #94

You posted links bvf Nov 2014 #95

In your opinion are believers deluded? el_bryanto Nov 2014 #96

It is also a place that is supposed to be free of disruptive trolling cbayer Nov 2014 #97

Brassieres and athletic supporters are supportive as well! MADem Nov 2014 #111

Thanks for the guffaw! kentauros Nov 2014 #112

Don't skim when you read, it will end in tears. MADem Nov 2014 #110

Perhaps you have confused Interfaitb with the ASAH Group. okasha Nov 2014 #74

kicking. hrmjustin Nov 2014 #75